From @YaleVM.YCC.YALE.EDU:LOJBAN@CUVMB.BITNET Thu Oct 14 03:21:17 1993 Received: from ELI.CS.YALE.EDU by NEBULA.SYSTEMSZ.CS.YALE.EDU via SMTP; Thu, 14 Oct 1993 10:17:09 -0400 Received: from YALEVM.YCC.YALE.EDU by eli.CS.YALE.EDU via SMTP; Thu, 14 Oct 1993 10:17:01 -0400 Message-Id: <199310141417.AA05117@eli.CS.YALE.EDU> Received: from CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU by YaleVM.YCC.Yale.Edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 8897; Thu, 14 Oct 93 10:15:02 EDT Received: from CUVMB.COLUMBIA.EDU by CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU (Mailer R2.07) with BSMTP id 5968; Thu, 14 Oct 93 07:24:32 EDT Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1993 07:21:17 -0400 Reply-To: Logical Language Group Sender: Lojban list From: Logical Language Group Subject: Re: more on fat gismu To: jorge@PHYAST.PITT.EDU Cc: lojban@cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu Status: RO X-Status: You are correct that Loglan/Lojban has never had cau we don't have "causeless" motion. Self-motion, we do have. If people want muvdu to be non-agentive, it can be considered. lebna, dunda, etc are motions in the sense of a transfer occuring, which often implies position. sorcu has the containment place because you need something to determine whether something is part of one sorcu or another. If you store something in one of three piles, is this one sorcu or three. I suspect that "containment" is a bad choice of words, since lo darxi pamei should be a valid value. I'll have to look at cikre off-line, but there was a similar reason based on how we thought it would be used. lojbab