Return-Path: Received: from kejal-9101.pc by xiron with uucp (Linux Smail3.1.28.1 #14) id m0omfFZ-0000osC; Tue, 12 Oct 93 10:38 EET Received: from kruuna.helsinki.fi by xiron with smtp (Linux Smail3.1.28.1 #14) id m0omfFC-0000osC; Tue, 12 Oct 93 10:38 EET Received: from charon2-gw.pc.Helsinki.FI by kruuna.helsinki.fi with SMTP id AA02308 (5.65c8/IDA-1.4.4 for ); Tue, 12 Oct 1993 10:37:07 +0200 Received: From HYLKN1/WORKQUEUE2 by charon2-gw.pc.Helsinki.FI via Charon 3.4 with IPX id 100.931012103543.288; 12 Oct 93 10:36:12 +0200 Message-Id: Received: From kruuna.helsinki.fi by charon2-gw.pc.Helsinki.FI via Charon 3.4 with SMTP id 102.931012103518.448; 12 Oct 93 10:35:19 +-02-01 Received: from finhutc.hut.fi by kruuna.helsinki.fi with SMTP id AA02147 (5.65c8/IDA-1.4.4 for ); Tue, 12 Oct 1993 10:36:08 +0200 Message-Id: <199310120836.AA02147@kruuna.helsinki.fi> Received: from FINHUTC.HUT.FI by FINHUTC.hut.fi (IBM VM SMTP R1.2.2MX) with BSMTP id 4284; Tue, 12 Oct 93 10:36:23 EET Received: from SEARN.SUNET.SE (NJE origin MAILER@SEARN) by FINHUTC.HUT.FI (LMail V1.1d/1.7f) with BSMTP id 4283; Tue, 12 Oct 1993 10:36:17 +0200 Received: from SEARN.SUNET.SE (NJE origin LISTSERV@SEARN) by SEARN.SUNET.SE (LMail V1.2a/1.8a) with BSMTP id 2900; Tue, 12 Oct 1993 09:35:39 +0100 Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1993 04:34:01 -0400 Reply-To: Logical Language Group Sender: vilva From: Logical Language Group Subject: Re: means/vehicle X-To: jorge@PHYAST.PITT.EDU X-Cc: lojban@cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu To: Veijo Vilva Content-Length: 487 Lines: 10 Actually, if we are considering deleting a means place from one of the motion words, I would be inclined to make it litru that has the place deleted. It is, after all, pure focus on the route, and I can see that the means is as speculatively superfluous as origin and destination. I have always seen klama as the most complete specification or concept, and it also has usage in the form of its BAI tag to add each of its 5 places onto other concepts that don't have the place. lojbab