Received: from ELI.CS.YALE.EDU by NEBULA.SYSTEMSZ.CS.YALE.EDU via SMTP; Wed, 27 Oct 1993 09:11:51 -0400 Received: from YALEVM.YCC.YALE.EDU by eli.CS.YALE.EDU via SMTP; Wed, 27 Oct 1993 09:11:46 -0400 Message-Id: <199310271311.AA04916@eli.CS.YALE.EDU> Received: from CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU by YaleVM.YCC.Yale.Edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 9275; Wed, 27 Oct 93 09:09:40 EDT Received: from CUVMB.COLUMBIA.EDU by CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU (Mailer R2.07) with BSMTP id 2955; Wed, 27 Oct 93 09:12:37 EDT Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1993 13:10:27 GMT Reply-To: I.Alexander.bra0125@oasis.icl.co.uk Sender: Lojban list From: Iain Alexander Subject: Re: TECH: muvdu place structure X-To: lojbab@access.digex.net X-Cc: lojban@cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu To: Erik Rauch Status: RO X-Status: X-From-Space-Date: Wed Oct 27 13:10:27 1993 X-From-Space-Address: @YaleVM.YCC.YALE.EDU:LOJBAN@CUVMB.BITNET la djan. kau,n. cusku di'e > We think smarter, is what we do. We may say "the man moves" in English, > but we don't say "le nanmu cu muvdu" in Lojban. It is "le birka be le nanmu > cu muvdu". This can't be the whole story, and my first instinct was that it was too simplistic, but perhaps it does lead us to the right answer. The problem is of course that you don't always want to specify a particular body part being moved. "Immobile" came up recently in a lujvo hunt, and I can't remember what was suggested then, but it probably wants to be some kind of muvdu. The solution's obvious once you've seen it - use {co'ermu'u} = {co'e muvdu} ~ {muvdu be le co'e} ~ {muvdu be zo'e} (I'm using the old agentive {muvdu} - substitute {muvgau} if you prefer). That gives something like {narka'eco'emu'u} = {na ka'e co'e muvdu} for "immobile". Some might prefer e.g. {narka'edavmu'u} or {nondavyka'emu'u}. mi'e .i,n.