Return-Path: <@FINHUTC.HUT.FI:LOJBAN@CUVMB.BITNET> Received: from FINHUTC.hut.fi by xiron.pc.helsinki.fi with smtp (Linux Smail3.1.28.1 #14) id m0pW84D-0000PeC; Mon, 14 Feb 94 20:30 EET Message-Id: Received: from FINHUTC.HUT.FI by FINHUTC.hut.fi (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 9561; Mon, 14 Feb 94 20:30:31 EET Received: from SEARN.SUNET.SE (NJE origin MAILER@SEARN) by FINHUTC.HUT.FI (LMail V1.1d/1.7f) with BSMTP id 9558; Mon, 14 Feb 1994 20:30:30 +0200 Received: from SEARN.SUNET.SE (NJE origin LISTSERV@SEARN) by SEARN.SUNET.SE (LMail V1.2a/1.8a) with BSMTP id 4705; Mon, 14 Feb 1994 19:29:37 +0100 Date: Mon, 14 Feb 1994 12:32:25 -0500 Reply-To: Logical Language Group Sender: Lojban list From: Logical Language Group Subject: Re: Place structures with {co} X-To: lojban@cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu To: Veijo Vilva In-Reply-To: <199402122018.AA16768@nfs1.digex.net> from "Jorge Llambias" at Feb 12, 94 02:59:07 pm Content-Length: 1206 Lines: 31 la veion. cusku di'e > > i.e. the purpose of co is to make the sumti places of the modifier more > > easily accessible. la xorxes. cusku di'e > These places are also easily accesible using {be}: > > brode co broda be da > > But the trailing places of brode are lost once the {co} appears. Ah, now the true root of the confusion appears. No, they aren't lost. "be...be'o" constructs are tight-binding, not loose-binding; they bind to the tanru-unit-2 (i.e. brivla or equivalent) immediately to the left. So you can get the x2 place of "brode" with "brode be de broda [be] da". I put the second "be" in brackets because (in selbri context) there is no difference between "mi klama le zarci" and "mi klama be le zarci". > My point is that it's not correct to say that {co} gives the possibility > to use modificand-modifier word order. It seems more logical to me that > the places of a tanru should always be those of the tertanru, without > this exception. The places of a tanru are those of the rightmost brivla, without exception. This is not necessarily the logical tertanru. -- John Cowan sharing account for now e'osai ko sarji la lojban.