Return-Path: <@FINHUTC.HUT.FI:LOJBAN@CUVMB.BITNET> Received: from FINHUTC.hut.fi by xiron.pc.helsinki.fi with smtp (Linux Smail3.1.28.1 #14) id m0pV5iu-0000PYC; Fri, 11 Feb 94 23:48 EET Message-Id: Received: from FINHUTC.HUT.FI by FINHUTC.hut.fi (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 9150; Fri, 11 Feb 94 23:48:14 EET Received: from SEARN.SUNET.SE (NJE origin MAILER@SEARN) by FINHUTC.HUT.FI (LMail V1.1d/1.7f) with BSMTP id 9149; Fri, 11 Feb 1994 23:48:14 +0200 Received: from SEARN.SUNET.SE (NJE origin LISTSERV@SEARN) by SEARN.SUNET.SE (LMail V1.2a/1.8a) with BSMTP id 1831; Fri, 11 Feb 1994 22:47:16 +0100 Date: Fri, 11 Feb 1994 16:42:27 EST Reply-To: jorge@PHYAST.PITT.EDU Sender: Lojban list From: Jorge Llambias Subject: Place structures with {co} X-To: lojban@cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu To: Veijo Vilva Content-Length: 1171 Lines: 47 la kolin cusku lu > ckire do doi xorxes le kecti pinka li'u i ue u'i ma kecti pinka i mi pu cusku le ckire pinka i mi na'e sanji le nu mi kecti te pinka > I cannot think of a way of inverting > broda brode da > as you are trying to do. > > brode co broda da > expressly means > broda be da co brode I guess you mean broda be da brode This is not the idea that I get from looking at the BNF, which has the trailing sumti attaching to the whole bridi, brode co broda da parses as: ({brode co broda} {da VAU}) Which suggests to me something different from: ({brode co } VAU) If {brode co broda da} doesn't mean {broda brode da}, then the claim that {co} is there to permit the modifier to come after the modificand (is this the right word?), as in some languages (like Spanish :) is not quite true, because using it restricts what we can say with that tanru. (A lot of places become inaccessible, unless used before the selbri.) So {broda brode} has a different place structure than {brode co broda}. (If a tanru can be said to have a place structure.) I'm not saying it's wrong, just that it's a bit strange. Jorge