Return-Path: <@FINHUTC.HUT.FI:LOJBAN@CUVMB.BITNET> Received: from FINHUTC.hut.fi by xiron.pc.helsinki.fi with smtp (Linux Smail3.1.28.1 #1) id m0r3uue-00005bC; Sun, 6 Nov 94 01:52 EET Message-Id: Received: from FINHUTC.HUT.FI by FINHUTC.hut.fi (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 0870; Sun, 06 Nov 94 01:53:01 EET Received: from SEARN.SUNET.SE (NJE origin MAILER@SEARN) by FINHUTC.HUT.FI (LMail V1.1d/1.7f) with BSMTP id 0867; Sun, 6 Nov 1994 01:53:00 +0200 Received: from SEARN.SUNET.SE (NJE origin LISTSERV@SEARN) by SEARN.SUNET.SE (LMail V1.2a/1.8a) with BSMTP id 0985; Sun, 6 Nov 1994 00:49:54 +0100 Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 18:43:34 -0500 Reply-To: DLS9@AOL.COM Sender: Lojban list From: DLS9@AOL.COM Subject: Re: veridicality trivial? X-To: lojban@cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu To: Veijo Vilva Content-Length: 1268 Lines: 36 bob@gnu.ai.mit.edu cuska di'e >jorge@phyast.pitt.edu cuska di'e > > In Lojban, an imperative is true iff the command is carried out. > Is that true? I thought imperatives didn't have truth values. >This is a fundamental misunderstanding of Loglan. *Every* predication >is considered true or false. This is fundamental to the language. >In a context where `the' is the appropriate translation for {lo}: > ko ciska lo plipe >Means "make it be true that `you eat the apple'" >So the question is, is the following utterance true? > do ciska lo plipe >If you do not eat the apple, it is false. It can only be true if you >do eat the apple. Hence, the imperative is true if and only if the >command is carried out. Why doesn't this seem right? Perhaps it might be better to think of an imperative as expressing the truth that the speaker wants the statement to become true. He who says {ko ciska lo plipe} wants {do ciska lo plipe} to be true. Similarly, interrogatives could be thought of as expressing the truth that the speaker wants some particular piece of information, for which he prompts the listener(s). In effect, an interrogative is an imperative to provide information. ko ciska lo plipe It is true that I want you to eat the apple.