Return-Path: <@FINHUTC.HUT.FI:LOJBAN@CUVMB.BITNET> Received: from FINHUTC.hut.fi by xiron.pc.helsinki.fi with smtp (Linux Smail3.1.28.1 #1) id m0r3ni9-00005bC; Sat, 5 Nov 94 18:11 EET Message-Id: Received: from FINHUTC.HUT.FI by FINHUTC.hut.fi (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 7441; Sat, 05 Nov 94 18:11:39 EET Received: from SEARN.SUNET.SE (NJE origin MAILER@SEARN) by FINHUTC.HUT.FI (LMail V1.1d/1.7f) with BSMTP id 7439; Sat, 5 Nov 1994 18:11:37 +0200 Received: from SEARN.SUNET.SE (NJE origin LISTSERV@SEARN) by SEARN.SUNET.SE (LMail V1.2a/1.8a) with BSMTP id 9380; Sat, 5 Nov 1994 17:08:13 +0100 Date: Sat, 5 Nov 1994 11:07:29 -0500 Reply-To: "Robert J. Chassell" Sender: Lojban list From: "Robert J. Chassell" Subject: veridicality trivial? X-To: lojban@cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu To: Veijo Vilva Content-Length: 1302 Lines: 41 jorge@phyast.pitt.edu cuska di'e > In Lojban, an imperative is true iff the command is carried out. Is that true? I thought imperatives didn't have truth values. This is a fundamental misunderstanding of Loglan. *Every* predication is considered true or false. This is fundamental to the language. In a context where `the' is the appropriate translation for {lo}: ko ciska lo plipe Means "make it be true that `you eat the apple'" So the question is, is the following utterance true? do ciska lo plipe If you do not eat the apple, it is false. It can only be true if you do eat the apple. Hence, the imperative is true if and only if the command is carried out. jorge@phyast.pitt.edu cuska di'e My point of view is this: Saying that {lo} is veridical is almost a triviality. Because of the fact that it is non-specific, it needs to be veridical or we lose any connection with meaning. This is why {lo} may be specific; {le} may be non-specific. Veridicality is an indicator of, i.e., a guide towards and away from, specificity (and definiteness). It all fits together as is. Robert J. Chassell bob@gnu.ai.mit.edu 25 Rattlesnake Mountain Road bob@grackle.stockbridge.ma.us Stockbridge, MA 01262-0693 USA (413) 298-4725