Return-Path: Received: from kantti.helsinki.fi by xiron.pc.helsinki.fi with smtp (Linux Smail3.1.28.1 #1) id m0rK7dd-00007DC; Tue, 20 Dec 94 18:42 EET Received: from fiport.funet.fi (fiport.funet.fi [128.214.109.150]) by kantti.helsinki.fi (8.6.9/8.6.5) with ESMTP id SAA03392 for ; Tue, 20 Dec 1994 18:42:12 +0200 Received: from SEARN.SUNET.SE (MAILER@SEARN) by FIPORT.FUNET.FI (PMDF V4.3-13 #2494) id <01HKVG8LS1BK0000FX@FIPORT.FUNET.FI>; Tue, 20 Dec 1994 16:41:14 +0200 (EET) Received: from SEARN.SUNET.SE (NJE origin LISTSERV@SEARN) by SEARN.SUNET.SE (LMail V1.2a/1.8a) with BSMTP id 0653; Tue, 20 Dec 1994 17:38:52 +0100 Date: Tue, 20 Dec 1994 11:39:35 -0500 From: Logical Language Group Subject: Re: kau and jai issues In-reply-to: <9412200419.1356@speech.language.unimelb.edu.au> from "Nick Legend Nicholas" at Dec 20, 94 03:19:34 pm Sender: Lojban list Reply-to: Logical Language Group Message-id: <01HKVG8LTLTU0000FX@FIPORT.FUNET.FI> X-Envelope-to: veion@XIRON.PC.HELSINKI.FI Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT To: Lojban List MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 1228 Lines: 28 la nitcion. cusku di'e > d) jai, irrespective of all this, *must* get a rafsi, and a good rafsi at > that. To not give it a rafsi is to limit expressiveness. It is precisely > with non-agentive raising --- which will happen a lot, which cannot be done > by -gau, and which is infrequent in our texts to date only because, as I've > often maintained, the consequences of unraised predicates have yet to sink in > in Lojbanistan --- where it will see most use, and where a rafsi will be sorely > missed, if absent. > > Give it a good rafsi. If jar or jan or jal or jam are available, let jai have > it. Usage won't argue for this because usage hasn't yet realised that unraised > predicates present difficulties, which can't be resolved just by -gau. It will > pay to plan ahead. Too late now. Every ja? rafsi is allocated except jax and jaz, and jaz is the better of the two. Even ja'i is gone, and any other ja'? rafsi is unthinkable. (jai jar jan jal jam are jgari, jdari, janco, janli, jamna respectively.) But I agree that "jai" does deserve a rafsi nonetheless, even if it's a not-so-good rafsi. -- John Cowan sharing account for now e'osai ko sarji la lojban.