Return-Path: Received: from kantti.helsinki.fi by xiron.pc.helsinki.fi with smtp (Linux Smail3.1.28.1 #1) id m0rMlGY-00007MC; Wed, 28 Dec 94 01:25 EET Received: from fiport.funet.fi (fiport.funet.fi [128.214.109.150]) by kantti.helsinki.fi (8.6.9/8.6.5) with ESMTP id BAA14702 for ; Wed, 28 Dec 1994 01:25:17 +0200 Received: from SEARN.SUNET.SE (MAILER@SEARN) by FIPORT.FUNET.FI (PMDF V4.3-13 #2494) id <01HL5MCXYBWW000OB1@FIPORT.FUNET.FI>; Tue, 27 Dec 1994 23:24:27 +0200 (EET) Received: from SEARN.SUNET.SE (NJE origin LISTSERV@SEARN) by SEARN.SUNET.SE (LMail V1.2a/1.8a) with BSMTP id 1627; Wed, 28 Dec 1994 00:22:01 +0100 Date: Tue, 27 Dec 1994 15:22:04 -0800 From: "John E. Clifford" Subject: terse tenses Sender: Lojban list To: Veijo Vilva Reply-to: "John E. Clifford" Message-id: <01HL5MCXYZGI000OB1@FIPORT.FUNET.FI> X-Envelope-to: veion@XIRON.PC.HELSINKI.FI Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-To: lojban list MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 757 Lines: 13 While I sympathize with the desire to get things in short in Lojban as in English, I don't think it is going to happen all the time. In particular, djer's latest shot as "ago" does not quite work. It is grammatical but not the grammar wanted -- as the parsings provided show. The phrase _zu'a_vei_ci_mitre_, for example, is not a tense but a modifier on the first sumti, _le_nanmu_, in this case. This interpetation is forced by the _cu_ after the phrase, forcing it into the first sumti scope. My aging parser (and dubious 286 machine) does not accept this without the _cu_, as a tense. The same applies to the other examples. BTW, will _vei_ci_mitre_ really mean "three meters away" or does it still mean "away from three meter-long things"? pc >|83