Received: from uga.cc.uga.edu by nfs1.digex.net with SMTP id AA04280 (5.67b8/IDA-1.5 for ); Wed, 7 Dec 1994 22:16:30 -0500 Message-Id: <199412080316.AA04280@nfs1.digex.net> Received: from UGA.CC.UGA.EDU by uga.cc.uga.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 5468; Wed, 07 Dec 94 22:14:03 EST Received: from UGA.CC.UGA.EDU (NJE origin LISTSERV@UGA) by UGA.CC.UGA.EDU (LMail V1.2a/1.8a) with BSMTP id 0732; Wed, 7 Dec 1994 20:05:02 -0500 Date: Wed, 7 Dec 1994 19:58:07 EST Reply-To: bob@GNU.AI.MIT.EDU Sender: Lojban list From: bob@GNU.AI.MIT.EDU Subject: Re: habitual/typical X-To: lojban@cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu To: Bob LeChevalier In-Reply-To: <199412080016.TAA06807@albert.gnu.ai.mit.edu> (message from Jorge Llambias on Wed, 7 Dec 1994 15:15:13 EST) Status: RO X-From-Space-Date: Wed Dec 7 22:16:35 1994 X-From-Space-Address: LOJBAN%CUVMB.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu > {na'o} Typically - standard measured or understood by, i.e., referent > tends to be the experience of other entities > similar to the entity concerned. > > lo mlatu na'o kalte loi smacu > A/The cat typically hunts mice. I assume that "the entity concerned" refers both to ... the cat and the mice ... Good point! It turns out that John Cowan's mechanism of Imaginary Journeys will help. * For {na'o}, you travel to and observe instances of hunting/being hunted in which other sumti are involved * For {ta'e}, you travel to and observe past time instances in which the same sumti are involved. Let's try this using Verb-Subject-Object sequence, as a heuristic to unsettle us. This makes it easier to see "the entity concerned" as being the whole bridi, i.e., the ecological relationship among hunting, cats, and mice. > na'o kalte fa lo mlatu loi smacu Hunting is a typical relationship between cats (x1 or hunter) and mice (x2 or prey). We look at other cats and other mice and other instances of hunting. This works, but you do have to look at the whole bridi. Now, let's try `habitually' in that utterance: > ta'e kalte fa lo mlatu loi smacu Here we have to look at the hunting and at the cat and its previous experience and at the mouse and its previous experience (or the plurals of these, or the `Mr. Mouse' entity). This works, too. Robert J. Chassell bob@gnu.ai.mit.edu 25 Rattlesnake Mountain Road bob@grackle.stockbridge.ma.us Stockbridge, MA 01262-0693 USA (413) 298-4725