Return-Path: Received: from kantti.helsinki.fi by xiron.pc.helsinki.fi with smtp (Linux Smail3.1.28.1 #1) id m0rIZFU-00007DC; Fri, 16 Dec 94 11:46 EET Received: from fiport.funet.fi (fiport.funet.fi [128.214.109.150]) by kantti.helsinki.fi (8.6.9/8.6.5) with ESMTP id LAA19022 for ; Fri, 16 Dec 1994 11:46:49 +0200 Received: from SEARN.SUNET.SE (MAILER@SEARN) by FIPORT.FUNET.FI (PMDF V4.3-7 #2494) id <01HKPGK2XXNK000DNE@FIPORT.FUNET.FI>; Fri, 16 Dec 1994 09:45:44 EET Received: from SEARN.SUNET.SE (NJE origin LISTSERV@SEARN) by SEARN.SUNET.SE (LMail V1.2a/1.8a) with BSMTP id 9443; Fri, 16 Dec 1994 10:43:31 +0100 Date: Fri, 16 Dec 1994 04:46:12 -0500 From: Logical Language Group Subject: Re: SE & FA Sender: Lojban list To: Veijo Vilva Reply-to: Logical Language Group Message-id: <01HKPGK2YELU000DNE@FIPORT.FUNET.FI> X-Envelope-to: veion@XIRON.PC.HELSINKI.FI Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-To: ucleaar@ucl.ac.uk X-cc: lojban@cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Length: 584 Lines: 17 >I am I right in these translations? > se mamta fa mi "I am a mother" > selmamta fa mi "I have a mother" > >--- >And No. "fa" manipulation is conseidered totally metalinguistic. You MUST physically rearrange the pieces to know what is meant. I think this even overrides scope issues, though I am not sure we addressed the issue. (Thus "broda de fa roda" would mean the same as "roda broda de"). I don't feel real strooong on scope interaction and "FA" if you-all who like to use it want scope to be spoken order dependent. I am more concerned with SE conversion. lojbab