Return-Path: Received: from fiport.funet.fi by xiron.pc.helsinki.fi with smtp (Linux Smail3.1.28.1 #1) id m0rbVkL-00001FC; Mon, 6 Feb 95 17:53 EET Received: from SEARN.SUNET.SE (MAILER@SEARN) by FIPORT.FUNET.FI (PMDF V4.3-13 #2494) id <01HMQGE0ZLEO002KNZ@FIPORT.FUNET.FI>; Mon, 06 Feb 1995 15:48:42 +0200 (EET) Received: from SEARN.SUNET.SE (NJE origin LISTSERV@SEARN) by SEARN.SUNET.SE (LMail V1.2a/1.8a) with BSMTP id 6231; Mon, 6 Feb 1995 16:49:33 +0100 Date: Mon, 06 Feb 1995 10:14:39 -0500 From: Logical Language Group Subject: zi'o (was: jorne) In-reply-to: <199502051649.AA13232@nfs2.digex.net> from "ucleaar" at Feb 5, 95 04:46:21 pm Sender: Lojban list To: Veijo Vilva Reply-to: Logical Language Group Message-id: <01HMQGE1L3LY002KNZ@FIPORT.FUNET.FI> X-Envelope-to: veion@XIRON.PC.HELSINKI.FI Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-To: Lojban List Content-Length: 1033 Lines: 22 la .and. cusku di'e > Personally I would favour 5 cmavo in SE meaning "delete x1/x2/x4/x4/x5", > or something similar that wouldn't require extra cmavo, such that > the deletion of a sumti-place is indicated by modification of the > selbri rather than by filling the deleted place. I think that would > make more apparent the lujvo-creating function of ziho. I wrestled with exactly that idea for a long time. The damned trouble is that lujvo aren't limited to just 5 places: they can have any number. So no such scheme will suffice: one needs the ability to include full numbers in lujvo. Now admittedly numbers do have rafsi, so the lujvo version of this would work quite well. But the expanded version, with "xi'o " seemed tremendously ugly. As a result, the current hole-plugging scheme is now used syntactically and the embedded-number scheme morphologically, which satisfies nobody. -- John Cowan sharing account for now e'osai ko sarji la lojban.