Date: Sat, 4 Feb 1995 06:38:38 -0500
From: Logical Language Group <lojbab>
Message-Id: <199502041138.AA15506@access4.digex.net>
Subject: jorne
X-From-Space-Date: Sat Feb  4 06:38:42 1995
X-From-Space-Address: lojbab

>From: Iain Alexander <ia@STRYX.DEMON.CO.UK>
>Subject:      ju'i LLG Re: ko .a'o fraxu mi...
>
>I'm putting this up front in English to improve the chances
>of a response from someone in LLG.
>
>Jorge thinks that
>
>jorne jon     jo'e joined
>x1 is joined to/connects to/is united with x2 at common locus x3;
>x1 and x2 are a union          6f  34
>[also joined/fastened/attached by joint x3/by means of x3/with fastener x3;
>fastener (= jo'etci, jonvelyla'a); train, sequence of joined objects
>(= jonpoi; porjo'e for a single object joined into a sequence)];
>(cf. lasna, fenso, kansa, pencu, penmi)
>
>is restricted to situations where the two objects meet at a point, or at
>least are close together.  Can it be used for two points being connected
>by a line (which I was trying to use it for), or the cord joining a
>television to the electric plug, or whatever?

This one isn't as tricky as I first thought.

Jorge may not understand a necessary convention of the gismu list, which
is limited for LogFlash usage to columns less than 159 or so for
content.  Explanatory material beyond 160 can add to what is in the
"main" definition.  In this case

>[also joined/fastened/attached by joint x3/by means of x3/with fastener x3;

are alternates to "common locus x3", as is indicated by the "also"
(usually an 'unlisted alternative' will be marked by "also", but I did
this manually and could have missed some).

One alternative to considering the line tyo be the x3 of the two points
is that you clearly have a sequence of joined objects by one
interpretation - the point ce'o the line ce'o the point are joined and
of course the "joint" is then an ordered sequence with one less element.
I find this elegant if not necessarily the easiest type of expression to
ponder.

lujvo distinguishing this type of non-common-locus joint from common
locus joints might be a useful creation.

>If not, what else do we use?  Is
>
>lasna         la'a fasten               'lash'
>x1 (agent) fastens/connects/attaches/binds/lashes x2 to x3 with fastener x4
>                     3f  17    [no implication that result is considered a
>single object; although x2 and x3 may be reversible, x3 may be used for the
>substrate, the fixed/larger object to which x2 becomes attached];
>(cf. jorne, fenso, jgena, batke, dinko, kansa)
>
>better (e.g. {zi'o lasna})?

I still abhor zi'o and would thus never suggest it %^)

Your Lojban discussion appears to have considered "linji" and "sirji"
and "sepli".  I would also consider "jbini" (between).  And in a pinch,
you have "pluta" (route).

lojbab