Return-Path: <@FINHUTC.HUT.FI:LOJBAN@CUVMB.BITNET>
Received: from FINHUTC.hut.fi by xiron.pc.helsinki.fi  with smtp
	(Linux Smail3.1.28.1 #1) id m0rh5oF-00001pC; Wed, 22 Feb 95 03:24 EET
Message-Id: <m0rh5oF-00001pC@xiron.pc.helsinki.fi>
Received: from FINHUTC.HUT.FI by FINHUTC.hut.fi (IBM VM SMTP V2R2)
   with BSMTP id 4174; Wed, 22 Feb 95 03:24:23 EET
Received: from SEARN.SUNET.SE (NJE origin MAILER@SEARN) by FINHUTC.HUT.FI (LMail V1.1d/1.7f) with BSMTP id 4171; Wed, 22 Feb 1995 03:24:23 +0200
Received: from SEARN.SUNET.SE (NJE origin LISTSERV@SEARN) by SEARN.SUNET.SE (LMail V1.2a/1.8a) with BSMTP id 3278; Wed, 22 Feb 1995 02:20:30 +0100
Date:         Tue, 21 Feb 1995 20:25:29 EST
Reply-To:     jorge@PHYAST.PITT.EDU
Sender:       Lojban list <LOJBAN%CUVMB.bitnet@FINHUTC.hut.fi>
From:         jorge@PHYAST.PITT.EDU
Subject:      Re: Existence and occurrence of events (was: ago24 & replies)
X-To:         lojban@cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu
To:           Veijo Vilva <veion@XIRON.PC.HELSINKI.FI>
Content-Length: 609
Lines: 14

And:
> > If the event I try for occurs, then I've succeeded. If some other related
> > event occurs, but not the one I've tried for, then I've failed.
>
> You're right if you translate it as {mi troci lo nu mi muvgau lo rokci}.
> If you translate it as {mi troci lo nu lo rokci cu muvdu} then you're
> wrong.

Why? What do you mean by {mi troci lo nu lo rokci cu muvdu}? Where does it
say that I have to be the agent of the movement? Does {troci} automatically
have a {gasnu} implied, so that {mi troci lo nu <agentless event>} is really
an elided form of {mi troci lo nu mi gasnu lo nu <said event>}?

Jorge