From dpt@abel.MATH.HARVARD.EDU  Sat Mar  6 22:45:15 2010
Date:         Fri, 19 May 1995 21:59:58 -0400
From: "Dylan P. Thurston" <dpt@abel.MATH.HARVARD.EDU>
Subject:      Re: Quantifiers (was Re: A modest proposal #2: verdicality)
To: Bob LeChevalier <lojbab@access.digex.net>
X-From-Space-Date: Sat May 20 01:52:02 1995
X-From-Space-Address: LOJBAN%CUVMB.BITNET@uga.cc.uga.edu
Message-ID: <fjAnoSH0geB.A.S4E.7t0kLB@chain.digitalkingdom.org>

ucleaar@ucl.ac.uk writes:
 > The sage voice of John Cojban admonishes:
 > > We're not at a stage where a rewrite is acceptable.  This is a stage
 > > many new and enthusiastic learners go through.  First, however, it's
 > > important to learn what has already been defined; it turns out to be
 > > more subtle than you expect.  (I speak from experience.)
 >
 > But once one has learnt what has been defined one learns not that
 > radical change would not lead to improvement but that achieving even
 > the slightest change constitutes, however great the improvements
 > they'd confer, a monumental triumph over the forces of conservatism.
 > Advocating grammar change in Lojbania is like advocating gun control
 > in the USA; sweet reason neither butters parsnips nor carries the day.

Alas, for the moment my reason is not sweet enough even to mount a
credible fight.  With experience will come wisdom.

But do not be so quick to give up hope.  Even now, in the dark moment of
despair, I see glimmers of light and rumors of change.  The {ke'a}
proposal is gaining momentum and things look promising on the tenses
front.  [Not that I've thought carefully enough about tenses to be sure
which change I support--certainly not mine, that's for sure.]

("butters parsnips"?)

 > My ambition is to look back in my dotage and tell my grandchildren
 > "See that cmavo? It was me that got it into the language"

Ah, foolish youth.  With age you will learn to hope instead to _remove_
cmavo from the language.

 > (One giant
 > leap for man, one small step for mankind), and they'll look on me not
 > with pity but with great awe and reverence, thereafter boasting to
 > their peers, to general gasps of iacuhi and ianai, mingled with uhe.io,
 > "Ti le bahe mibrorpatfu oha oha cu cmavo se fuzme".

A wonderful rant.  You won't mind if I pick one nit, will you?  {patfu}
should not be used metaphorically for "author, creator".  Perhaps
{dzena} (ancestor, elder) or {rirni} (caregiver) would be appropriate in
a metaphor.

(And yes, I know I've been using {cmugau patfu} for "Founding Fathers."
Umm...  Jorge started it?)

mu'o mi'e. dilyn.