From @uga.cc.uga.edu:lojban@cuvmb.bitnet Fri Jun 02 22:53:59 1995 Received: from punt2.demon.co.uk by stryx.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA3229 ; Fri, 02 Jun 95 22:53:57 BST Received: from punt2.demon.co.uk via puntmail for ia@stryx.demon.co.uk; Thu, 01 Jun 95 23:49:54 GMT Received: from uga.cc.uga.edu by punt2.demon.co.uk id aa01657; 2 Jun 95 0:49 +0100 Received: from UGA.CC.UGA.EDU by uga.cc.uga.edu (IBM VM SMTP V2R2) with BSMTP id 4428; Thu, 01 Jun 95 19:47:49 EDT Received: from UGA.CC.UGA.EDU (NJE origin LISTSERV@UGA) by UGA.CC.UGA.EDU (LMail V1.2a/1.8a) with BSMTP id 4239; Thu, 1 Jun 1995 19:46:19 -0400 Date: Thu, 1 Jun 1995 19:46:35 -0400 Reply-To: "Dylan P. Thurston" Sender: Lojban list From: "Dylan P. Thurston" Subject: non-existance predications X-To: lojban@cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu To: Iain Alexander In-Reply-To: <01HR3U6JYWC2BIL28R@NETOP6.HARVARD.EDU> Message-ID: <9506020049.aa01657@punt2.demon.co.uk> Status: R la lojbab. cusku di'e > .. > Since the "na" has scope of the entire bridi, there is no problem. It > converts to "naku lo crida zo'u lo crida cu zasti" "It is not the case > that: for something that is a fairy, that fairy exists." > > The problem arises if you have a selbri which requires non-existance. > Let us say that "nalzasti" is such a selbri (at one time "xanri" had > this meaning). Would {tolzasti} be better? > Then: "lo crida cu nalzasti" could cause a problem if > there are no such things as fairies. I'm not sure it does, because for > me, the equivalent "lo crida zo'u lo crida cu nalzasti", the prenexing > in the "lo crida" form contains no stronger claim of existence than it > does in the main text. But in the "da poi" form there is a clear > problem: da poi crida zo'u da nalzasti clearly is false because you > have postulated the existance of da in the prenex, then said that da > not-exists, contradicting yourself. Right. In fact, {lo broda cu tolzasti} is always false--this says, in English, "Some brodas do not exist", which is clearly non-sensical. What does make sense is {ro crida cu tolzasti}. > lojbab mu'o mi'e. dilyn.