From cowan  Sat Mar  6 22:57:49 2010
Subject: Re: logical issues (lambda,ka, man-dogs, etc.)
To: lojban@cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu (Lojban List)
From: cowan
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 1995 10:38:36 -0500 (EST)
In-Reply-To: <199511220345.WAA12348@locke.ccil.org> from "Jorge Llambias" at Nov 21, 95 10:35:23 pm
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24]
Content-Type: text
Content-Length:       1845
Status: OR
X-From-Space-Date: Wed Nov 22 10:38:36 1995
X-From-Space-Address: cowan
Message-ID: <8hd9QJoW6PG.A.5sB.t50kLB@chain.digitalkingdom.org>

la poi cabna .xorxes. cusku di'e

> Also interesting are his "kinds": individual, stage, and generic.
> "Generic" I think corresponds to Lojban's {lo'e}, but Lojban makes
> no distinction between his "individuals" and "stages": {mi se cmene
> zo xorxes} and {mi klama le zarci} use the same {mi}, even though the
> first is mi the individual and the second is only a stage of mi the
> individual.

Poof.  In fact, "mi se cmene zo xorxes" became true only when you joined
the Lojban community.  All claims are about stages; some stages may last
as long as the individual does.  To think otherwise is a residue of
essentialism.

More seriously, the Kesh (a culture who will be living some centuries from
now in California, {du'o} Ursula K. LeGuin) have three names, conventionally
called "first name", "middle name", and "last name".  However, the English
translation is seriously misleading!  The first name is given by one's
parent, the middle name (which supersedes the first name) is adopted by
oneself at adulthood, and the last name (which supersedes the middle name)
is adopted, also by oneself, at menopause or its male analogues.

(When a male character, under the influence of a more masculinist culture,
adopts the unusual name of "Spear", one of his friends comments, "Why
doesn't he just call himself 'Big Penis' and have done with it?")

>      All even prime numbers greater than three are multiples of 27.
>      Yes, indeed there are no even prime numbers greater than three.
> 
> Is that really bad English?

I would certainly call it unidiomatic, and would say:

	No, indeed there are no even prime number greater than three.

I suspect this is connected with the English habit of saying "No" to
affirm a negative question:

	Aren't you going?
	No, I'm not going.

-- 
John Cowan					cowan@ccil.org
		e'osai ko sarji la lojban.