Return-Path: LOJBAN%CUVMB.BITNET@vms.dc.LSOFT.COM Received: from SEGATE.SUNET.SE (segate.sunet.se [192.36.125.6]) by xiron.pc.helsinki.fi (8.6.12/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA02471 for ; Thu, 7 Dec 1995 17:19:16 +0200 Message-Id: <199512071519.RAA02471@xiron.pc.helsinki.fi> Received: from listmail.sunet.se by SEGATE.SUNET.SE (LSMTP for OpenVMS v1.0a) with SMTP id 3799792E ; Thu, 7 Dec 1995 16:19:16 +0100 Date: Thu, 7 Dec 1995 10:01:34 -0500 Reply-To: "Robert J. Chassell" Sender: Lojban list From: "Robert J. Chassell" Subject: Observatives (simple) X-To: lojban@cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu, bob@rattlesnake.com To: Veijo Vilva In-Reply-To: <199512070105.UAA12429@minerva.phyast.pitt.edu> (message from Jorge Llambias on Wed, 6 Dec 1995 20:05:54 -0500) Content-Length: 984 Lines: 28 > What is the semantic difference between {ta blanu} and {blanu fa ta}? {ta blanu} and {blanu fa ta} are both examples of bridi with a filled first place. Both utterances mean "This at which I point is blue." The difference in meaning, if any, is in emphasis. ta blanu *This* is blue. blanu fa ta This is *blue*. Incidentally, Jorge said regarding this query: I don't see any special semantic content in the "observative" form. I don't know what he meant here. Neither of those examples are observatives. An observative lacks a first place: blanu A blue thing. Look: something blue. See section 2 in John Cowan's Places paper for an example with {klama}: klama la bastn. la .atlantas. le dargu le karce A-goer to-Boston from-Atlanta via-the road using-the car. Goes to-Boston from-Atlanta via-the road using-the car. Look: a goer to Boston from Atlanta via the road using the car!