Return-Path: LOJBAN%CUVMB.BITNET@vms.dc.LSOFT.COM Received: from SEGATE.SUNET.SE (segate.sunet.se [192.36.125.6]) by xiron.pc.helsinki.fi (8.7.1/8.7.1) with ESMTP id QAA05172 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 1996 16:41:24 +0200 Message-Id: <199601121441.QAA05172@xiron.pc.helsinki.fi> Received: from listmail.sunet.se by SEGATE.SUNET.SE (LSMTP for OpenVMS v1.0a) with SMTP id E4EFB5DE ; Fri, 12 Jan 1996 15:41:25 +0100 Date: Fri, 12 Jan 1996 13:40:49 GMT Reply-To: Don Wiggins Sender: Lojban list From: Don Wiggins Subject: sera'aku le'ala'ezo PLI mezoigy. still gy. To: Veijo Vilva Content-Length: 1848 Lines: 53 cu'u la kris. tu'e .i lu<< mi pu'o viska ko'a >>li'u to'i fi toi mi stidi to'i fe toi lenu mi bazi viska ko'a tu'u .i ja'a mi ka'e ba viska ko'a .iku'i lenu mi ca'a ba viska ko'a cu na sarcu [It is true that I will be able to see him, but the actuality of seeing him is not necessary.] cu'u la kris. tu'e .i ku'i zoigy. still gy. na stidi fi ledu'u xukau mi ba ba'e *ze'e* viska ko'a tu'u .iku'i ra stidi ledu'u mi ba'e nu'o pujeca viska kei .aledu'u mi ba'e ka'e ba viska [But it suggests that up to now I could have, but didn't see him and that in the future I could actually see him though not necessarily.] cu'u la kris. tu'e .i .e'u lu<< mi za'o na viska ko'a >>li'u tu'u .i .ienaisai .i mi fanva ri fuzoigy. It is false that I see him longer than expected gy. .azoigy. I don't see him for too long gy. [I disagree. I would translate it as "It is false that I see him longer than expected" or "I don't see him for too long".] "za'o viska" is very difficult to render in English. So let's change to cook. .i mi jukpa lo rectu I cook some meat. .i mi za'o jukpa lo rectu I over-cook some meat. Not "I am still cooking some meat", but the event is running beyond its natural limit. .i mi ca'o jukpa lo rectu I continue to cook some meat. I am still cooking some meat. I am already cooking some meat. The cooking is on-going. It may that the cooking has not finished yet as expected or that it has commenced before expected. The point is that the cooking is happening at this point. There is no implication that it is over-cooking. .i mi pu'o jukpa lo rectu I am not yet cooking some meat. The cooking is not on-going. In the future it may or may not start, but the expectation is that it will, this is certainly implied by the English use of "yet". Like all future events one can only have expectation of what will happen.