From - Mon Jul 29 12:51:51 1996
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Date:         Mon, 29 Jul 1996 09:50:00 PDT
Reply-To: Andrew Smith <adms@YCO.LEEDS.AC.UK>
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From: Andrew Smith <adms@YCO.LEEDS.AC.UK>
Subject:      Re: may the wind....
To:         cbogart <cbogart@pocc.gpsmet.ucar.edu>
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Thanks for replying so promptly and thought-provokingly.

I agree with your exhortation to avoid metaphors and be explicit if there is
any reason to believe you may be misunderstood (computer, alien, etc), but
the difficulty is deciding whether a metaphor is appropriate in a particular
context.

>   - some metaphors might be obvious to any intelligent being regardless
       of culture (?is this true?)

This seems plausible, but which ones are obvious?
The gimste tells us to avoid using 'heart' for 'love' but suggests  'brain'
for 'intelligence'.
I'm not suggesting this is wrong, but it seems to me dangerous to assume
that 'brain'='intelligence' everywhere.

>   - very often Lojban interlocutors will happen to be from the same
        or related cultures

This  is a minefield, as I'm sure you're well aware. There are any number of
misunderstandings between Americans and Britons speaking the same-ish
language from a related culture.
To give a lojban example, without digging all the old discussion up again, I
didn't understand the term 'besna kafke' at all, because I had never heard
the American expression 'brain fart'

>   - maybe there will eventually be a lojbanic subculture with its
        own metaphors

Now this is the most promising. I can see that  pe'a can be used for lojban
metaphors. We still have the difficulty of creating metaphors that are
non-culture-specific, or at least lojban-specific, but that seems a likely
source of real lojban metaphors. (We'll probably still have arguments about
where the metaphors originate, mind...!)

>"May circumstances always assist you like a tailwind assists a ship".

Yes!!
A compromise with the best of both worlds. A metaphor and a clear
description of the meaning. The best yet, anyway, in my opinion.

Thanks again

co'o mi'e .andruc,
[adms@yco.leeds.ac.uk]