From lojban@cuvmb.bitnet Sat Jul 27 00:57:57 1996 Received: from punt4.demon.co.uk by stryx.demon.co.uk with SMTP id AA13348 ; Sat, 27 Jul 96 00:57:47 BST Received: from punt-4.mail.demon.net by mailstore for ia@stryx.demon.co.uk id 838381903:03121:2; Fri, 26 Jul 96 12:51:43 BST Received: from cunyvm.cuny.edu ([128.228.1.2]) by punt-4.mail.demon.net id aa03038; 26 Jul 96 12:51 +0100 Received: from CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU by CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU (IBM VM SMTP V2R3) with BSMTP id 5833; Fri, 26 Jul 96 07:50:44 EDT Received: from CUVMB.COLUMBIA.EDU by CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU (Mailer R2.07) with BSMTP id 6293; Fri, 26 Jul 96 07:50:29 EDT Date: Fri, 26 Jul 1996 04:51:47 -0700 Reply-To: Robert Weiss Sender: Lojban list From: Robert Weiss Subject: Re: may the wind be always at your back X-To: lojban@cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu To: Multiple recipients of list LOJBAN In-Reply-To: <9607260031.AA32700@ewald.mbi.ucla.edu> Message-ID: <838381864.3038.0@cunyvm.cuny.edu> Status: R I was going to bring this up during the discussion a few months ago about "all men are equal, but some are more equal than others," and now that we're talking about "may the wind always be at your back" I have another opportunity. As I understand Lojban, the literal translation of these aphorisms contains no more than their literal meaning, e.g., either that there should be some wind in back of a person (now what could that mean?) or that some wind should be blowing towards his back. Now, that's not really what the original means at all. There's no doubt some name for this which I don't know, so I'll call it the real meaning, which is "may you generally be assisted in all your endeavors". Shouldn't that be the proper thing to translate into Lojban? Bob Weiss On Fri, 26 Jul 1996, Colin Fine wrote: > vecu'u le notci po'u <838323171.25315.0@vms.dc.lsoft.com> la Chris > Bogart cu cusku di'e > >> I'm trying to figure out how to say "may the wind be always at your > >> back." What I've got so far is: > >> > >> ko cu stoga'e le rixfarbi'e ku > >> (I command you to)constantly feel the wind from the behind-direction > >> > >> Basically I'm trying to figure out how to express the "may you" bit. I > >> was thinking of using "pacna" (wish/hope/expect), but I'm not sure how to > >> say "I hope that xyz is true" without having to resort to "xyz. I hope > >> that ko'a is true". > > > >I don't have my gi'uste with me, but what you put looks good grammatically. > >Another way you might try it is using .a'o > > > >As for grammar -- you don't need the "cu" or the "ku", but they are > >acceptable -- it's a question of what style you prefer. > > > >co'o mi'e kris > > Yes, that's precisely what UI are for. > Furthermore, I don't think you want "ko" here - it's not a command to > the hearer. > > I would say > do stoga'e le rixfarbi'e a'o > or more laconically > roroi brife le do trixe .a'o > (at all times something is a wind from the rear of you [hope]) > > This is still fairly literal, and probably not really what is wanted. > > Better still would be > brife nagi'a trixe .a'o do > (something is a wind only-if [it] is-behind [hope] you). > > co'o mi'e kolin > -- > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > | Colin Fine 66 High Ash, Shipley, W Yorks. BD18 1NE, UK | > | Tel: 01274 592696 e-mail: colin@kindness.demon.co.uk | > | "Losing is a state of mind, not a fact of life." -K.B.Brown | > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- >