Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 04:26:42 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199710140926.EAA12639@locke.ccil.org> Reply-To: Robin Turner Sender: Lojban list From: Robin Turner Subject: ninmu X-To: lojban@cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu To: John Cowan X-Mozilla-Status: 0001 Content-Length: 1453 Lines: 43 Just a point about "femininity" - is it actually possible to use "ninmu" quantitively? The definitions are given as: x1 is a woman/women x1 is a female humanoid person (not necessarily adult) The first is culturally specific, and I assume it is given as a "rough" definition. For example, in English the main criteria for "woman" are female human having attained physical/social maturity whereas in Turkish they are female human non-virgin though in both languages other factors may take priority (e.g. in Turkish a very young non-virgin would still probably be referred to as a "girl" while a very old virgin would not). Given this cultural basis for definition, I assume that this would be unsuitable for Lojban, since, for example, english and Turkish native speakers would then use "ninmu" differently. Looking at the second definition, one is presumably either a female humanoid person or one is not - there are no degrees here (except possibly with "humanoid" in the case of alien races - Vulcans resemble humans more than Klingons do, for example). To use "ni" with "ninmu" would then be to use "ninmu" metaphorically, which I don't think is appropriate. For this use we would need a separate word with the definition x1 [conforms to appearance/behaviour of women] [in culture x2] Robin Turner Bilkent Universitesi, IDMYO, Ankara, Turkey.