Date: Wed, 19 Nov 1997 19:45:58 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199711200045.TAA15651@locke.ccil.org> Reply-To: JORGE JOAQUIN LLAMBIAS Sender: Lojban list From: JORGE JOAQUIN LLAMBIAS Subject: Re: Events, Sisku, le, lo X-To: lojban To: John Cowan Status: OR X-Mozilla-Status: 0011 Content-Length: 2260 X-From-Space-Date: Wed Nov 19 19:46:03 1997 X-From-Space-Address: LOJBAN@CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU >> Could someone explain what an "intension" is? > >As I learned it, the referent of a set in extension is all of the members > separately. >Example: > > mi nelci ro lo mlatu > I like all cats = I like cat #1 AND I like cat #2 AND etc. etc. > >Whereas, the referent of a set in intension is the set itself: > > mi nelci lo'i mlatu What is "the referent of a set"? As I understand it, sets can be defined by intension or by extension. For example this is the same set defined two ways: {2,4,6,8} = {x/x is an even integer between 1 and 9} . Another example, suppose I have three cats, then these two would be the same set: {la tom ce la feliks ce la floras}, the set defined by extension, and {le'i ci mlatu pe mi}, the same set defined by intension. >I'm not really sure what that would mean, applied to cats, which are not >collective creatures, although to me it makes >a lot more sense when used for numbers and things like that. British usage > makes the distinction: > > It was revealed that the government _are_ corrupt (each politician > individually) > Therefore the government _is_ about to fall (as a collective unit) But this doesn't have to do with intension/extension, as far as I understand it. >And now the thread wanders off into masses (loi), and I think >I've done enough damage for today. Right, that's the distinction you are making here, not much to do with descriptions by intension/extension. It rather has to do with collective/distributive reference: {lei turni} = those that govern taken as a whole, {le turni} = each of those that govern. Here we are making reference to different entities: in one case a single entity, in the other case each of several entities. Suppose that there are 4 people who govern, to make it simple. Then you can refer to the set of those who govern either by extension: {le pamoi turni ce le remoi turni ce le cimoi turni ce le vomoi turni} or by intension: {le'i turni}. In both cases you're referring to the same object. You can say something about each of them by extension: {le pamoi turni e le remoi turni e le cimoi turni e le vomoi turni cu klama le zarci} Or you can say the same thing about each of them by intension: {le vo turni cu klama le zarci} co'o mi'e xorxes