Date: Sat, 6 Dec 1997 05:26:41 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <199712061026.FAA22848@locke.ccil.org> Reply-To: Logical Language Group Sender: Lojban list From: Logical Language Group Subject: Re: Are tanru really metaphors? X-To: rwhe@APOCALYPSE.ORG X-cc: lojban@cuvmb.cc.columbia.edu To: John Cowan Status: O X-Mozilla-Status: 0011 Content-Length: 1859 X-From-Space-Date: Sat Dec 6 05:26:42 1997 X-From-Space-Address: LOJBAN@CUVMB.CC.COLUMBIA.EDU >>Another solution would be prefix all your utterances with {pe'a}, thus >>telling listeners to interpret what follows figuratively. >> >> >> pe'a PEhA start figurative >> start figurative (non-literal) speech/text >> >> po'a POhA end figurative >> end figurative (non-literal) speech/text Indeed, Athelstan discussed keenings specifically in an early JL. I do not know whether he mentione dit in the discussion, but at that point we certainly agreed that the logical way to deal with all poetry of a genre (as for example skaldic poetry which uses kennings) would be to define a whole set of conventions, which in this case would include the figurativeness of tanru, and the "title" might include either the set of conventions, or a reference thereto ("according to rules la skaldik") which would enable the entire text to be treated as following these variant semantic rules rather than the default lojbanic ones. Note that we already have something like this in terms of the "story-time" tense convention, which differs from non-story-time tense usages. What has never been done is to explicitly mark variant semantics, though it was envisions from very early on. I may rummage around and see if I can find the article Athelstan wrote. I have long intended to put old JLs on line, but it is something I have bnever gotten around to yet %^) lojbab ---- lojbab lojbab@access.digex.net Bob LeChevalier, President, The Logical Language Group, Inc. 2904 Beau Lane, Fairfax VA 22031-1303 USA 703-385-0273 Artificial language Loglan/Lojban: ftp.access.digex.net /pub/access/lojbab or see Lojban WWW Server: href="http://xiron.pc.helsinki.fi/lojban/" Order _The Complete Lojban Language_ - see our Web pages or ask me.