Message-ID: <34916B0C.1659@locke.ccil.org> Date: Fri, 12 Dec 1997 11:49:16 -0500 From: John Cowan Organization: Lojban Peripheral X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Lojban List Subject: Re: whether (was Re: ni, jei, perfectionism) References: <199712120356.WAA21496@locke.ccil.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mozilla-Status: 0011 Content-Length: 853 X-From-Space-Date: Fri Dec 12 11:49:16 1997 X-From-Space-Address: - la xorxes. cusku di'e > > I don't see much difference between: > >I know where John went (indirect question). > >I know the place where John went (relative clause). > > But they are different! The first one doesn't say that you know > the place, it only says that you know where it is that John went. > If you don't know Buenos Aires, you may still know that John went to > Buenos Aires. If John went to New York, and you know N.Y., > but you don't know that John went there, you still know the place > where he went. I can get both readings of the second example: one synonymous with the first example, where "know the place" means "know the identity of the place", and one meaning what you indicate, where "know the place" means "be familiar with the place". -- John Cowan http://www.ccil.org/~cowan cowan@ccil.org e'osai ko sarji la lojban