Date:         Fri, 22 May 1998 19:03:34 +0100
Reply-To:     George Foot <george.foot@MERTON.OXFORD.AC.UK>
Sender:       Lojban list <LOJBAN@CUVMB.BITNET>
From:         George Foot <george.foot@MERTON.OXFORD.AC.UK>
Subject:      Re: Guides to learning gismu
To:           Multiple recipients of list LOJBAN <LOJBAN@CUVMB.BITNET>
In-Reply-To:  <199805221321.OAA02582@sable.ox.ac.uk>
Message-ID: <895860304.1118208.0@listserv.cuny.edu>
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On Sat, 23 May 1998, Chris Double wrote:

> What are some good ways people use to get familiar with the gismu? So far
> I've browsed through the gismu list to get an overall idea of what is
> available (looking at meaning not place structure). Then I've translated a
> few lojban texts and learnt some of the gismu as I went through that. I've
> tried using LogFlash but I find that it is incredibly difficult for me to
> remember the large number of gismu that flash by and the next time I sit
> down to do a session I've forgotten them all!

I too had that problem with LogFlash.  The solution is, of
course, to try harder ;).  What I actually did was to set up two
users for myself, and put one into the more intense mode.  I
think this introduced me to a wider range of words straight
away, which is possibly a drawback, and the words spend a long
time jumping up and down the drop-back piles.  However, when
they eventually do go into the under control pile, you really do
know them.

My first attempts at learning gismu took place last September,
and for various reasons I was unable to use LogFlash for a long
time.  When I got back to it, though, I was surprised at how
many words I could remember.

I think it's natural in any language to get to know some words
more than others; especially because of idiom.  People on this
mailing list, I noticed when I joined, tend to use certain words
and phrases a great deal -- "coidoi rodo" is a fairly normal
"Hello" message, and "co'o mi'e djordj" is a way of signing off
a Lojban message.  I think if you can concentrate on learning
the more commonly used words then you stand a good chance of
understanding what people are saying.  However, you do need
quite a large vocabulary of gismu (which I too lack), so working
through LogFlash is I think a worthwhile thing to do.  Even if
you forget a lot of the words, you will have seen them before.
I find my Lojban->English translation is better than
English->Lojban, because I recognise aspects of gismu and tend
to remember the clues that LogFlash gives.  Also, running
LogFlash in an intense mode means that you get a great deal of
practice at words that you are having trouble remembering.

When learning with LogFlash I also find it better not to spend
too long staring at the words and translations trying to
remember them, when it shows you the words it is introducing.
Just look over them fairly quickly.  You'll notice `interesting'
ones that you might find useful when writing Lojban, so you'll
probably remember those.  For the others, you could sit there
trying to learn them -- or you could just go into the test mode,
and let LogFlash teach them to you.  If you try to learn them
from the list, you may as well not be using LogFlash!

In summary, my advice (which may of course not coincide with
other people's advice!) is to move on to the gaining control
mode fairly quickly, spend only a short time looking at new word
lists, and don't get frustrated if some words that you find
difficult don't seem to ever go away.

Note that learning gismu isn't everything -- you also need to
know how to use them, and particularly how various cmavo work.
I didn't like LogFlash3 much, but perhaps I didn't use it
enough.  I'm finding that the best way to learn the cmavo is to
read the reference grammar.  That's what it's for, after all :).

Good luck.

--
george.foot@merton.oxford.ac.uk

xu do tavla fo la lojban  --  http://xiron.pc.helsinki.fi/lojban/lojban.html