X-Digest-Num: 57 Message-ID: <44114.57.222.959273824@eGroups.com> Date: Wed, 10 Feb 1999 18:51:57 GMT+0 From: And Rosta Subject: Re: accent X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 222 Content-Length: 1151 Lines: 28 "michael helsem" > it can be assumed that native-lojbanist english speakers would convert > the phonemes (h)(short a)(voiceless th)(voiced th) into lojban's > (x)(e)(t)(d). that's what happens with natural bilinguals. > also, they might have trouble with some of english's voiced/unvoiced > consonant combinations, & i imagine would insert a schwa accordingly. I think I'm persuaded by that. [h] and [T] (th) occur in Lojban but only allophonically and intervocalically. Still, you don't *normally* spot or identify foreign accents by these specific segmental substitutions (though certain ones are a dead giveaway, such as [dz] for /dZ/ being very Greek) - it's more complex and subtle than that. Think of all the foreign (= not English) languages that lack [T] and [D], yet observe how different French, German, Italian accents are from each other and from Cockney or Mancunian (also [T]/[D]-less). It would be interesting to know to what extent a Lojban accent has already evolved, e.g. in Virginia. I gather, for example, that Virginian Lojban /a/ is realized with a very back [A]. --And.