X-Digest-Num: 58
Message-ID: <44114.58.224.959273824@eGroups.com>
Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 13:41:30 +0200
From: Robin Turner <robin@bilkent.edu.tr>
Subject: Re: Accent
X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 224
Content-Length: 2043
Lines: 50

Lin Zhemin wrote:

> Wed, 10 Feb 1999, zo Robin Turner(robin@Bilkent.EDU.TR) cusku di'e
> > For once I think I've caught Ivan out!  Although Mandarin doesn't have
> > exactly the same /l/r/ sounds as English, there's still a distinction e.g.
> > "ren", "li".
>
> Well... "ren" is only a method to symbolise one sound.

I don't understand what you mean here.  I meant "ren" as in "person".

> Indeedly,
> we can pronounce american English "r" very well, since between Mandarin "r"
> and american English "r" is there only very slight difference (the position
> of the tongue, that I believe).

{.ie za'a} Mandarin /r/ has the tongue slightly further back, though again it
varies according to regional accents {mu'a} the famous "ershui" (did I spell
that right?) of Northern China, where "feng" comes out sometimes as "fengr"
{zo'o ta'o ba'a } North Chinese should have no problem with Lojban intervocalic
"r".

> I'm curious and learning British way pronouncing "r". I listen to BBC
> broadcasting everyday, but it seems that some people pronounce just as
> american English "r", and some do as those in all the old style movies
> (e.g. Emma). A bit confused then. This topic is however away from the
> list....

The English tend to elide the final /r/, unless the following word starts with a
vowel, and generally /r/ is less prominent than in most American dialects.
Scots roll the /r/ so it's more of an /R/ (if I remember my IPA correctly - it's
been a long time since I studied phonetics).

{bi'u}  One way native language/dialect shows in Lojban is how people Lojbanise
names.  {mu'a} Americans Lojbanise "John" as {la djan.}, {si'anai} I would write
it as {la djon.} {ta'o ku'i ru'a} this could lead to confusion with "Joan".
{ji'a mu'a} You might be able to tell where someone came from in Turkey
according to whtehr they Lojbanised "Türk" as {turk} or {tirk} {ta'o} I know
John Cowan says it has to be {tirk}, but in practice we wouldn't be able to
legislate on this.

co'o mi'e robin. noi ca'a raptadni lei cnima'o