Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 22:50:09 -0000
To: lojban@onelist.com
Subject: Translating names
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From: "Quantum Seep" <qseep@iname.com>
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I have noted that there is more than one way to translate a name into
Lojban, depending supposedly on the wishes of the name's bearer, or
the users of the name.  One way is to use a phonetic translation. 
For example, the name "John" may become the cmene "djan."  The rules
of Lojbanization presented in section 4.8 of the reference grammar.

However, sometimes a semantic translation is preferable.  For
example, a person with the nickname "Bear" might want a Lojban name
looking something like "cribe."  However, it is not clear to me
whether that word should be left as a gismu or turned into a cmene -
and if so, how.

For example, if Bear wrote this book (as on page 124), should I say
a) "la cribe pu finti le vi cukta" or b) "la criben pu finti le vi
cukta".  In (a) I leave the name as a gismu, while in (b) I attempt
to turn it into a cmene by adding an "n".  Also, in the case of (b),
are the final letters "s" and "n" preferred, and if so, why?

There are also some cases where names have been formed by creating
improper lujvo.  I say "improper" because although they are formed
from rafsi, they illegally end in a consonant.  However, they are
intended as cmene and are legal as such.  An example is the name
"lojban" which is formed from rafsi for "logji" and "bangu."  Is this
a preferred way of constructing names when they are made from tanru? 
Could the language just as well have been called "la lojbangu"
(lujvo)or "la lojbangun" (cmene)?

As if I was not already confused enough, I found a third way of
constructing names in the book.  In example 10.3 of chapter 6, the
book says "mi viska la'e lu le xunre cmaxirma li'u" ("I see 'The Red
Pony'") which refers to a book by its title.  Isn't a person's name
also just a referent?  Then why couldn't refer to the person named
Bear as "la'e lu cribe li'u"?  Or could I?  What would be the
connotation?

Thanks for your help.  Translating names is some basic stuff and I'm
a bit confused.

- Quantum Seep