From sentto-44114-2961-960362936-mark=kli.org@returns.onelist.com Wed Jun 07 07:26:48 2000 Return-Path: Delivered-To: shoulson-kli@meson.org Received: (qmail 8183 invoked from network); 7 Jun 2000 07:26:47 -0000 Received: from zash.lupine.org (205.186.156.18) by pi.meson.org with SMTP; 7 Jun 2000 07:26:47 -0000 Received: (qmail 10480 invoked by uid 40001); 7 Jun 2000 07:29:00 -0000 Delivered-To: kli-mark@kli.org Received: (qmail 10477 invoked from network); 7 Jun 2000 07:29:00 -0000 Received: from c9.egroups.com (207.138.41.187) by zash.lupine.org with SMTP; 7 Jun 2000 07:29:00 -0000 X-eGroups-Return: sentto-44114-2961-960362936-mark=kli.org@returns.onelist.com Received: from [10.1.10.35] by c9.egroups.com with NNFMP; 07 Jun 2000 07:28:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 17913 invoked from network); 7 Jun 2000 07:28:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (10.1.10.27) by m1.onelist.org with QMQP; 7 Jun 2000 07:28:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO argo.bas.bg) (195.96.224.7) by mta2 with SMTP; 7 Jun 2000 07:28:53 -0000 Received: from banmatpc.math.bas.bg (root@banmatpc.math.bas.bg [195.96.243.2]) by argo.bas.bg (8.11.0.Beta1/8.9.3/Debian 8.9.3-6) with ESMTP id e577SiY32092 for ; Wed, 7 Jun 2000 10:28:49 +0300 Received: from iad.math.bas.bg (iad.math.bas.bg [195.96.243.88]) by banmatpc.math.bas.bg (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id KAA32360 for ; Wed, 7 Jun 2000 10:28:43 +0300 Message-ID: <393DF91A.417C@math.bas.bg> Organization: Institute for Mathematics and Computer Science X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win95; I; 16bit) To: The Lojban List References: <63.680da91.266d17db@aol.com> From: Ivan A Derzhanski MIME-Version: 1.0 Mailing-List: list lojban@egroups.com; contact lojban-owner@egroups.com Delivered-To: mailing list lojban@egroups.com Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: Date: Wed, 07 Jun 2000 10:26:18 +0300 Reply-To: iad@math.bas.bg Subject: Re: [lojban] Again: transcription of Chinese cmene Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit pycyn@aol.com wrote: [re lojbanising Chinese] > But is there no final /m/ in Mandarin? > I suppose, /dim sum/, being food, is Cantonese. Exactly, and the Mandarin for it is _dian3 xin1_. Part of the reason I suggested {m} for M _-n_ is that it often corresponds to C _-m_, or to _m_ in Sino-Korean. In Russian M _n_ is represented as palatalised _n'_ and M _ng_ as non-palatalised _n_. The contrast is replaced by one that has no phonetic similarity to it -- but it is not lost. {ng} is available too, but then we can't guarantee that speakers won't separate the {n} from a {g} by a buffer vowel, and that would distort the sound significantly. The same goes for affricates, of course. I don't think {beid|jin|g} is acceptable. > More to the point, can we get a good vowel spread with the limited lb set? The Chinese set is even more limited, only in a different way. It shouldn't be difficult. --Ivan ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Looking for Airfare deals? Visit Expedia.com for limited time offers http://click.egroups.com/1/5205/3/_/17627/_/960362919/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------ To unsubscribe, send mail to lojban-unsubscribe@onelist.com