From ragnarok@pobox.com Wed Nov 14 03:48:56 2001 Return-Path: X-Sender: raganok@intrex.net X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_0_0_1); 14 Nov 2001 11:48:56 -0000 Received: (qmail 5601 invoked from network); 14 Nov 2001 11:48:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (216.115.97.171) by m4.grp.snv.yahoo.com with QMQP; 14 Nov 2001 11:48:56 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO intrex.net) (209.42.192.250) by mta3.grp.snv.yahoo.com with SMTP; 14 Nov 2001 11:48:56 -0000 Received: from Craig [209.42.200.98] by intrex.net (SMTPD32-5.05) id AA30D5DB0094; Wed, 14 Nov 2001 06:49:04 -0500 Reply-To: To: Subject: RE: [lojban] Why is there so much irregularity in cmavo/gismu? Date: Wed, 14 Nov 2001 06:48:38 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 In-Reply-To: <20011113210606.B1673@twcny.rr.com> Importance: Normal X-eGroups-From: "Craig" From: "Craig" X-Yahoo-Profile: kreig_daniyl X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 12121 >I agree completely. In English, questions and emotions are expressed >using entirely different grammar; in Lojban, they are expressed with the >same grammar, and this is wonderfully illustrated by the fact that 'ui' >and 'xu', concepts which we would not think of relating in English, share >the same selma'o. I like the fact that .ui and xu have the same grammar. But it is silly to claim that answering two questions about grammar which are really quite different with the same answer means that they were the same question all along. This is not a case of quantum physics where once the answers are known to be the same, the questions become the same. But most of you haven't realized that, because you are stuck thinking about them as the same due to selma'o .ui! Imagiine that prior to reading the Book, Jimbob learns about selma'o. So he asks me, "What selma'o is .ui in?" I tell him, "UI." He asks what UIs do, and I say that all but one of them show emotions, being in the grammatical class (se cmavo) that we call interjections in English. But xu has a radically different grammatical meaning. It got stuck in UI because it acts like the real UIs, but it is just there to ask yes or no questions. Jimbob says, "That's stoopid. Why are they in the same class, when the only similarity is where you can put them?" And then, (a'o'ecai) the entire jboste achieves enlightenment. --la kreig.daniyl. 'lonu zasti ce lonu na zasti cu finsi'u .i loka nandu ce loka frili cu riksi'u .i loka clani ce loka tordu cu mresi'u .i loka galtu ce loka dizlu cu bapsi'u .i lo voksa joi lo sance cu saxsi'u .i caku lo purci lo bavli cu katyje'i' -la lautsyn. xy.sy. gubmau ckiku nacycme: 0x5C3A1E74