From Ti@fa-kuan.muc.de Fri Dec 07 00:33:17 2001
Return-Path: <Ti@fa-kuan.muc.de>
X-Sender: Ti@fa-kuan.muc.de
X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com
Received: (EGP: mail-8_0_1_2); 7 Dec 2001 08:33:18 -0000
Received: (qmail 94789 invoked from network); 7 Dec 2001 08:33:18 -0000
Received: from unknown (216.115.97.167)
  by m5.grp.snv.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Dec 2001 08:33:18 -0000
Received: from unknown (HELO n11.groups.yahoo.com) (216.115.96.61)
  by mta1.grp.snv.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Dec 2001 08:33:18 -0000
Received: from [216.115.96.119] by n11.groups.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 07 Dec 2001 08:33:18 -0000
Date: Fri, 07 Dec 2001 08:33:16 -0000
To: lojban@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: Romany and Romanian
Message-ID: <9upusd+le6o@eGroups.com>
In-Reply-To: <0112062142200S.18860@neofelis>
User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Content-Length: 1900
X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster
From: "aolung" <Ti@fa-kuan.muc.de>
X-Originating-IP: 149.225.135.169
X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=37407270
X-Yahoo-Profile: aolung
X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 12527

--- In lojban@y..., Pierre Abbat <phma@o...> wrote:
> On Thursday 06 December 2001 21:15, pycyn@a... wrote:
> > How did we get 'em confused in the first place? One is eccentric Romanc=
=3D=0D
e,
> > the eccentric Indic and, though I suppose the Dom came through Roumania=
=3D=0D
 on
> > their way to Western Europe, I don't think they lingered there more tha=
=3D=0D
n
> > most places (til next week's pogrom).  As far as I ever heard (never in=
=3D=0D

> > ideals circumstances) the initial consonant in the Gypsy selfname is a
> > retroflex voiced stop, whence the d/r variation.  Maybe we can call the=
=3D=0D
m
> > Doms (Indians regularly take English alveolars as retroflex since they =
=3D=0D
are
> > back of the native detnals).
>=20
> I found the word {natmrsindo} on the tutra pe le terdi page. Where did th=
=3D=0D
at=20
> come from?

Romania in Romanian is spelled like in English (where the final-a is the ar=
=3D=0D
ticle, without it it's just "Rom=E2nie").
Its pronounced different though: about {romyNIa} or {romyNIe}.
The R. language is "rom=E2neste" {romynecte} or "limba rom=E2na" {limba rom=
Yny}=3D=0D
.

"romno" m, or "romni" f, means gypsy man or woman. "Roma" now refers to Gyp=
=3D=0D
sies from Eastern European decent, "Sinti"=20
(Sindi) is the name for German (Western) Gypsy people. (sindo=3Dman).

Originally, "rom" (romm, xom, rum, romma, rommi) means "man" (male), husban=
=3D=0D
d, Gypsy (e.g. rom=E9skro=3Dmale, romeskro dad=3D
father-in-law, rom=E9skri dai=3Dmother-in-law, romedino=3Dmarried etc. etc.=
). It'=3D=0D
s from aind. "dom"=3Dman from low decent who plays=20
music in the streets etc.

sinto (sindo, sendo, mostly in pl. sindi, sindhi, sendi, sinte, zinde etc.)=
=3D=0D
 from Hindustani: s=E4nt, Balochi: sand, Sindhi: sandhu, Pali:=20
sandhi with the meaning of Bund, joined group etc. (hindustan.: sathi=3Dcom=
ra=3D=0D
de)

mi'e .aulun.