From sentto-44114-15096-1029414151-lojban-in=lojban.org@returns.groups.yahoo.com Thu Aug 15 05:23:08 2002 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Thu, 15 Aug 2002 05:23:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com ([66.218.66.85]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with smtp (Exim 4.05) id 17fJeZ-0005FM-00 for lojban-in@lojban.org; Thu, 15 Aug 2002 05:23:03 -0700 X-eGroups-Return: sentto-44114-15096-1029414151-lojban-in=lojban.org@returns.groups.yahoo.com Received: from [66.218.67.195] by n29.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 15 Aug 2002 12:22:32 -0000 X-Sender: Pycyn@aol.com X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_0_7_4); 15 Aug 2002 12:22:31 -0000 Received: (qmail 46746 invoked from network); 15 Aug 2002 12:22:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Aug 2002 12:22:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO imo-r04.mx.aol.com) (152.163.225.100) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Aug 2002 12:22:31 -0000 Received: from Pycyn@aol.com by imo-r04.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v33.5.) id r.169.122c59f2 (3956) for ; Thu, 15 Aug 2002 08:22:25 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <169.122c59f2.2a8cf701@aol.com> To: lojban@yahoogroups.com X-Mailer: AOL 7.0 for Windows US sub 10509 From: pycyn@aol.com X-Yahoo-Profile: kaliputra MIME-Version: 1.0 Mailing-List: list lojban@yahoogroups.com; contact lojban-owner@yahoogroups.com Delivered-To: mailing list lojban@yahoogroups.com Precedence: bulk Date: Thu, 15 Aug 2002 08:22:25 EDT Subject: Re: [lojban] kau -- What does it really mean?! Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_169.122c59f2.2a8cf701_boundary" X-archive-position: 626 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: pycyn@aol.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-list@lojban.org X-list: lojban-list --part1_169.122c59f2.2a8cf701_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 8/14/2002 7:15:27 PM Central Daylight Time, a-rosta@alphaphe.com writes: > , kau became meaningless; it converts direct > questions into indirect questions. In my view, it can't even be > seen as some kind of logical converter, because I think indirect > questions are semantically more basic than direct questions This seems an odd position: how can one talk about a direct question until there is one to talk about. Admitedly, if you go by the performative-verb-head style grammar, then questions arise from a "I ask Q" structure, but there is no reason to think that, at that level, Q is distinctly indirect, that being a surface feature which might emerge if the preformative is also brought to the surface. --part1_169.122c59f2.2a8cf701_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 8/14/2002 7:15:27 PM Central Daylight Time, a-rosta@alphaphe.com writes:

, kau became meaningless; it converts direct
questions into indirect questions. In my view, it can't even be
seen as some kind of logical converter, because I think indirect
questions are semantically more basic than direct questions

This seems an odd position: how can one talk about a direct question until there is one to talk about. Admitedly, if you go by the performative-verb-head style grammar, then questions arise from a "I ask Q" structure, but there is no reason to think that, at that level, Q is distinctly indirect, that being a surface feature which might emerge if the preformative is also brought to the surface.

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