From edward.cherlin.sy.67@aya.yale.edu Thu Sep 12 16:29:41 2002 Return-Path: X-Sender: edward.cherlin.sy.67@aya.yale.edu X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_1_1_3); 12 Sep 2002 23:29:40 -0000 Received: (qmail 77897 invoked from network); 12 Sep 2002 23:29:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.217) by m9.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Sep 2002 23:29:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mta5.snfc21.pbi.net) (206.13.28.241) by mta2.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Sep 2002 23:29:40 -0000 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([216.102.199.245]) by mta5.snfc21.pbi.net (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.1 (built May 7 2001)) with ESMTP id <0H2C009GGMLFZ0@mta5.snfc21.pbi.net> for lojban@yahoogroups.com; Thu, 12 Sep 2002 16:29:40 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2002 19:31:34 -0400 Subject: Re: [lojban] How would you translate this? In-reply-to: <3D7E4D47.1090502@cs.technion.ac.il> To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Message-id: <200209120350.22409.cherlin@pacbell.net> Organization: Saybrook '67 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable User-Agent: KMail/1.4.3 References: <3D7E4D47.1090502@cs.technion.ac.il> From: Edward Cherlin X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=31895329 X-Yahoo-Profile: echerlin X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 15632 On Tuesday 10 September 2002 03:51 pm, Alex Gontmakher wrote: > Remember the Lord of the Rings, when the party wants to enter > Moria, it is written there "Speak, friend, and enter" (which, as it > turns out, means: speak "friend" and then enter). > > How could that be translated to lojban? Or should we make comments > describing the ambiguity of the sentence in the natural language. It's really quite simple. Gandalf mistranslates the inscription. You=20 can mistranslate from any ambiguous language into any language,=20 including Lojban. There is no need for ambiguous Lojban. > Well, in English it looks like deliberately wrong (the "say friend > and enter" would not be that much ambiguous). Probably in Elvish it > is cleaner. In other languages I know, the difference also exists, > though not as definite as in Lojban. But, can Lojban play this > trick at all? > > mi'e sacas. > > p.s. Not that I would miss such ambiguities in the language. But if > the language cannot translate Tolkien... oops ;-) > > > > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor > ---------------------~--> Plan to Sell a Home? > http://us.click.yahoo.com/J2SnNA/y.lEAA/MVfIAA/GSaulB/TM > ------------------------------------------------------------------- >--~-> > > To unsubscribe, send mail to lojban-unsubscribe@onelist.com > > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/ --=20 Edward Cherlin Generalist "A knot! Oh, do let me help to undo it!" --Alice in Wonderland