From ragnarok@pobox.com Thu Feb 27 13:52:33 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: lojban-out@lojban.org X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (EGP: mail-8_2_3_4); 27 Feb 2003 21:52:33 -0000 Received: (qmail 95627 invoked from network); 27 Feb 2003 21:52:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m11.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 27 Feb 2003 21:52:31 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO digitalkingdom.org) (204.152.186.175) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 27 Feb 2003 21:52:31 -0000 Received: from lojban-out by digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.12) id 18oVx9-0003CD-00 for lojban@yahoogroups.com; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 13:52:31 -0800 Received: from digitalkingdom.org ([204.152.186.175] helo=chain) by digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 18oVwr-0003Bs-00; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 13:52:13 -0800 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Thu, 27 Feb 2003 13:52:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp.intrex.net ([209.42.192.250]) by digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 18oVwl-0003Bh-00 for lojban-list@lojban.org; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 13:52:07 -0800 Received: from craig [209.42.200.67] by smtp.intrex.net (SMTPD32-7.13) id A866B3B01E6; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 16:51:34 -0500 To: Subject: [lojban] Re: Any (was: Nick will be with you shortly) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 16:51:34 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2910.0) In-Reply-To: <20030227152733.C95554-100000@granite.thestonecutters.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Importance: Normal X-Declude-Sender: ragnarok@pobox.com [209.42.200.67] X-archive-position: 4199 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: ragnarok@pobox.com Precedence: bulk X-list: lojban-list From: "Craig" Reply-To: ragnarok@pobox.com X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=48763382 X-Yahoo-Profile: kreig_daniyl X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 18665 >> > > The Any problem (how to say Any shark as distinct from A shark in the >> > > completely general case) admits of several solutions, none perfect, >> > > although we're now putting more thought into it; when we go into >> > > non-existing entities, we add something like {tu'o lo se ka co'e} or >> > > something (to be thrashed out), as distinct from {lo co'e} (which >> > > commits to existence of the referent; And, this was the coup John and I >> > > pulled on you in NYC.) >> > >> > If you're not worried about stating the existence of the thing, lo is just >> > fine for "any". This is true in the cases of doctors and boxes. If you >> > slaughter all doctors and crush all boxes, you win, I'm wrong. I suppose >> [...] >> >> But "mi djica lo mikce" is true under different circumstances than >> "mi djica mikce". It's clearer if you translate to english; >> the first: There is a doctor (some doctors) that I need. >But since you do not have a particular doctor in mind (since you used lo >and not le!) then any doctor will do. At least, you asked for any doctor. Certainly. However, "mi djica le mikce" means the same thing. The only difference is that lo mikce must have an md, le mikce could be anyone I want to call a doctor. Lo and le do not mark for definition.