From lojban-out@lojban.org Mon Nov 24 10:55:43 2003 Return-Path: X-Sender: lojban-out@lojban.org X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 53333 invoked from network); 24 Nov 2003 18:55:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.166) by m5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 24 Nov 2003 18:55:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO chain.digitalkingdom.org) (64.81.49.134) by mta5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 24 Nov 2003 18:55:30 -0000 Received: from lojban-out by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.22) id 1AOLmt-0001Gi-7c for lojban@yahoogroups.com; Mon, 24 Nov 2003 10:50:19 -0800 Received: from chain.digitalkingdom.org ([64.81.49.134]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.22) id 1AOLmN-0001Ft-Ti; Mon, 24 Nov 2003 10:49:47 -0800 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Mon, 24 Nov 2003 10:49:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from rlpowell by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.22) id 1AOLm8-0001Fh-CS for lojban-list@lojban.org; Mon, 24 Nov 2003 10:49:32 -0800 Date: Mon, 24 Nov 2003 10:49:32 -0800 Subject: [lojban] Re: Is srana symmetrical? Message-ID: <20031124184932.GU9729@digitalkingdom.org> Mail-Followup-To: lojban-list@lojban.org References: <20031124180229.GR9729@digitalkingdom.org> <20031124184727.33947.qmail@web41905.mail.yahoo.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20031124184727.33947.qmail@web41905.mail.yahoo.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.4i X-archive-position: 6763 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: rlpowell@digitalkingdom.org X-list: lojban-list To: lojban@yahoogroups.com X-eGroups-From: Robin Lee Powell From: Robin Lee Powell Reply-To: rlpowell@digitalkingdom.org X-Originating-IP: 64.81.49.134 X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=116389790 X-Yahoo-Profile: lojban_out X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 21244 On Mon, Nov 24, 2003 at 10:47:27AM -0800, Jorge Llamb?as wrote: > > --- Robin Lee Powell wrote: > > On Sun, Nov 23, 2003 at 06:10:23PM -0800, Jorge Llamb?as wrote: > > > The tag {sera'a} is used much more frequently than plain > > > {ra'a}. That at least would seem to suggest that {srana} is > > > not symmetrical. > > > > That is much more likely to be because the keyword for ra'a, > > "pertained to by", is incredibly confusing. > > > > I, for one, have no idea what it means, and have been avoiding > > ra'a for that reason. > > I think the idea of {srana} is that it means "x1 is about x2". I think that might be the case, but I think it might also mean "x1 is relevant to x2". > mi sanga sera'a le vi cukta > I sing about this book. > My singing is about this book. > > mi sanga ra'a le vi cukta > I sing "pertained to by" this book. > This book is about my singing. OK, that makes sense. Can you think of a better phrase than "pertained to by" that doesn't require re-arranging sentence order in the English translation? -Robin -- Me: http://www.digitalkingdom.org/~rlpowell/ *** I'm a *male* Robin. "Constant neocortex override is the only thing that stops us all from running out and eating all the cookies." -- Eliezer Yudkowsky http://www.lojban.org/ *** .i cimo'o prali .ui