From reverendzow@yahoo.com Fri Jul 23 01:27:47 2004 Return-Path: X-Sender: reverendzow@yahoo.com X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 41035 invoked from network); 23 Jul 2004 08:27:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.218) by m21.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 23 Jul 2004 08:27:47 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com) (66.218.66.68) by mta3.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 23 Jul 2004 08:27:47 -0000 Received: from [66.218.66.116] by n13.grp.scd.yahoo.com with NNFMP; 23 Jul 2004 08:27:17 -0000 Date: Fri, 23 Jul 2004 08:27:16 -0000 To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Message-ID: User-Agent: eGroups-EW/0.82 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Length: 3427 X-Mailer: Yahoo Groups Message Poster X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 66.218.66.68 From: "reverendzow" X-Originating-IP: 66.241.95.142 Subject: Projects X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=193074467 X-Yahoo-Profile: reverendzow X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 22708 I came upon Lojban on Wednesday, and I am very happy to see that it exists. It is quite similar to the language I have been (incrementally and unsuccessfully) building over the last 10-15 years, but is much better developed. There are a few projects I am interested in beginning/helping with. NB: As the archives of this group are rather large, I have not yet combed through them. I hope my questions aren't the kind of things that are asked too frequently. Also, I don't always know what I'm talking about; proceed accordingly. First, I am interested in building a (relatively simple) Lojban command-line interface with duplicates of some of the basic tools found in the GNU suite. This seems feasible, but I will likely need help with some of the grammar and vocabulary. I think this would be an important step in acquiring wider support for Lojban. I am also interested in initiating (and potentially managing, but not -being-) a project to create a unique symbology for Lojban, in three parts. The first part (related, perhaps to Hangeul, Hebrew, and Kanji) would represent cmavo (in a purely symbolic fashion). A phonetic alphabet (for cmene and fu'ivla) would be the second part. Lastly, a set of ideograms for gismu. This requires the potential to make a simple visual system for making lujvo, else the phonetic alphabet could be used for gismu and lujvo as well. I am very curious regarding this potential. Also, it seems to me that if the cmavo lerfu is inviable, the rest of the project is rather pointless. Additionally, I am finding a need for a schematically defined syntax for Lojban. In attempting to create such a definition, I often come across logical constructs which have no Lojban names. For instance, what shall we call words that possess brivla? I have come up with ka'eserafsi, although my construction may be flawed, and a word based on fu'ivla may be better. Similarly, it seems the selma'o are named after the most commonly used elemental cmavo, rather than a Lojban meaning of their function. Finally, I see that the Lojban end of the lexicon is entirely arbitrary, and I think this is probably good for a couple reasons. To clarify: the definitions of words seem to be well thought out and are relatively fixed (esp. the cmavo). The words being defined, however, could be changed, and (if changed properly) with the sole consequence of requiring /piji'i lo'i lojban ve tavla do/ to learn the new vocabulary. The reason I think this may be a good thing to do is that I doubt sufficient research has been put into the worldwide pronuncibility and comprehensibility of the language. For instance, most Japanese have trouble differentiating American L/R, and pronouncing our R. I'm sure there are other examples, but I'm only a phoneticist by hobby, and know only scraps of languages. I also think a more optimal fashion of creating the smallest words is possible. Lastly, I wonder wether any consultation of experts in computerized voice-recognition has taken place. Their input on viable sounds to include in a language could be invaluable. The point is: it is quite likely that the vocabulary needs serious optimization/reform if widespread adoption of Lojban is to occur. (A request to anyone who knows more appropriate terms for any of the concepts I have used above: Please give me this information.)