From lojban-out@lojban.org Mon Oct 18 04:52:11 2004 Return-Path: X-Sender: lojban-out@lojban.org X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 38107 invoked from network); 18 Oct 2004 11:52:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.167) by m6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 18 Oct 2004 11:52:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO chain.digitalkingdom.org) (64.81.49.134) by mta6.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 18 Oct 2004 11:52:10 -0000 Received: from lojban-out by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.34) id 1CJVxU-0006zh-TV for lojban@yahoogroups.com; Mon, 18 Oct 2004 04:45:49 -0700 Received: from chain.digitalkingdom.org ([64.81.49.134]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1CJVwF-0006xx-OS; Mon, 18 Oct 2004 04:44:32 -0700 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Mon, 18 Oct 2004 04:44:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from web51607.mail.yahoo.com ([206.190.38.212]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with smtp (Exim 4.34) id 1CJVvc-0006xA-FT for lojban-list@lojban.org; Mon, 18 Oct 2004 04:43:55 -0700 Message-ID: <20041018095641.63423.qmail@web51607.mail.yahoo.com> Received: from [62.57.116.105] by web51607.mail.yahoo.com via HTTP; Mon, 18 Oct 2004 02:56:41 PDT Date: Mon, 18 Oct 2004 02:56:41 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <200410180017.37693.phma@phma.hn.org> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-archive-position: 8740 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: jordimastrullenque@yahoo.com X-list: lojban-list To: lojban@yahoogroups.com X-eGroups-Remote-IP: 64.81.49.134 X-eGroups-From: jordi mas From: jordi mas Reply-To: jordimastrullenque@yahoo.com Subject: [lojban] Re: jinku fi la paludizm X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=116389790 X-Yahoo-Profile: lojban_out X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 23147 > I agree; devoicing the 's' just before the voiced > 'm' at the end is hard. coi pier. Doesn't look hard for me, or at least not harder than devoicing the c in "cmene". OTOH it would be hard in "sd". > I pronounce it as 'z' in French, and pronounce other > words similarly in English > ("paludism" is uncommon in English; it's usually > called "malaria"). Spanish > doesn't have a distinct 'z' phoneme; it's an > allophone of 's'. The z sound appears in Spanish as an allophone of s in all sd combinations as in "desde", but I don't think that happens in "comunismo" too. Or maybe it does? As I am a native speaker, the fact that I don't hear the voicing proves nothing. > (The letter > 'z' is pronounced 'th' or 's', depending on dialect, Yes, the letter is 'th' in the north half of Spain, and indistinguishable from /s/ in the dialects spoken by the remaining 95% of speakers. A few of these dialects realize both and as 'th', most of them as different variants os s. > and I don't think it occurs immediately before 'm'.) It does, as in "hazmerreír" = "laughingstock". I pronounce this z with a th sound, not dh. No allophonic change here. is one of the few letters which can appear at the end of a syllable, so you can hear it followed by anything else. mu'omi'ejordis. ===== __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Address AutoComplete - You start. We finish. http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail