From deletesoftware@yandex.ru Sun Jun 12 04:44:30 2005 Return-Path: Date: Sun Jun 12 04:44:30 2005 X-Sender: deletesoftware@yandex.ru X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 57488 invoked from network); 12 Jun 2005 11:44:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.166) by m24.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 12 Jun 2005 11:44:29 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mx14.yandex.ru) (213.180.200.14) by mta5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 12 Jun 2005 11:44:29 -0000 Received: from h122.keldysh.ru ([194.226.57.122]:61455 "EHLO [194.226.57.122]" smtp-auth: "deletesoftware" TLS-CIPHER: "RC4-MD5 keybits 128/128 version TLSv1/SSLv3" TLS-PEER-CN1: ) by mail.yandex.ru with ESMTP id S1782370AbVFLLo1 (ORCPT ); Sun, 12 Jun 2005 15:44:27 +0400 X-Comment: RFC 2476 MSA function at mx14.yandex.ru logged sender identity as: deletesoftware Message-ID: <42AB43C4.4020007@yandex.ru> Date: Sun, 12 Jun 2005 00:04:20 +0400 Organization: Delete Software Limited User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.2 (Windows/20050317) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Opi Lauma References: <20050611110228.40598.qmail@web33409.mail.mud.yahoo.com> In-Reply-To: <20050611110228.40598.qmail@web33409.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Originating-IP: 213.180.200.14 X-eGroups-Msg-Info: 1:12:0 From: "Aleksej R. Serdyukov" Subject: Re: [lojban] Re: Lojban for Beginners lesson 12 answers X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=209292576; y=wDWqQDIg1yIFqbdJA7LFUXGoCk-HM2Cp42DgALa7KpNej24yM5DGXag X-Yahoo-Profile: deletesoftware X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 24507 Opi Lauma wrote: > I know how Moscow and St. Petersburg sound in Russian (some think > like “masKVA” and “sank pietierBURK”). And I think that correct > Lojban names are {la masKVA} and {la sank pietierBURK}, respectively. I'd rather write {pitirburk} or at least {pitierburk}, because the yot is too much, IMHO. > There is an official transliteration system for transforming names > written in Cyrillic into Latin symbols. According to this system > Moscow is Moskva. However, the second “o” sounds not like Lojban’s Transliterations (nothing to do with transcription) don't matter, especially "official" ones (there are many of them, some use apostrophes, some quotes (for the soft and hard signs) and some use "jj" for "й"! Some people have problems in airports because of the apostrophes and quotes in their names. > “o” (since in Russian there is no one to one correspondence between > letters and sounds). The “o” in Moskva sound similar with Lojban’s > “a” (in English “but”). Strictly speaking it sounds a little bit > different, but anyway it is closer to “a” rather to Lojban’s schwa > “y” (like in English America). Hahaha, the Cyrillic transcription used for Russian (somewhere ... why don't they try IPA? it would be something like мъ-сква in the mentioned transcription) made me think of {la m,skuas.}, as a syllabic "m" seems to make the sound. > Moreover, Russian “e” is definitely not Lojban’s “e”. It is why I > have replaced “e” by “ie” in St. Petersburg. Hm, {la lojban mo.} gives [ɛ] and [e] for the "e". The latter is the one I'd use.