From lojban-out@lojban.org Mon Sep 19 14:12:55 2005 Return-Path: X-Sender: lojban-out@lojban.org X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 26592 invoked from network); 19 Sep 2005 21:12:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.166) by m35.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Sep 2005 21:12:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO chain.digitalkingdom.org) (64.81.49.134) by mta5.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Sep 2005 21:12:54 -0000 Received: from lojban-out by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.52) id 1EHSwb-0001JS-Ol for lojban@yahoogroups.com; Mon, 19 Sep 2005 14:12:57 -0700 Received: from chain.digitalkingdom.org ([64.81.49.134]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1EHSvS-0001IH-EV; Mon, 19 Sep 2005 14:11:51 -0700 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Mon, 19 Sep 2005 14:11:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.52) id 1EHSv8-0001Hy-P3 for lojban-list-real@lojban.org; Mon, 19 Sep 2005 14:11:26 -0700 Received: from zproxy.gmail.com ([64.233.162.197]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1EHSv3-0001Hq-HZ for lojban-list@lojban.org; Mon, 19 Sep 2005 14:11:26 -0700 Received: by zproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id k1so257536nzf for ; Mon, 19 Sep 2005 14:11:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.36.91.2 with SMTP id o2mr1633614nzb; Mon, 19 Sep 2005 14:11:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.36.36.8 with HTTP; Mon, 19 Sep 2005 14:11:14 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <8f2fd4aa0509191411109485ba@mail.gmail.com> Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 14:11:14 -0700 In-Reply-To: <925d175605091913312603b4d3@mail.gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by Ecartis Content-Disposition: inline References: <8f2fd4aa05091500343852e987@mail.gmail.com> <8f2fd4aa05091514151b3f6cb7@mail.gmail.com> <8f2fd4aa05091514431061dd5b@mail.gmail.com> <925d175605091518303b4b7bb2@mail.gmail.com> <8f2fd4aa0509151931507cdc42@mail.gmail.com> <925d1756050916175611735157@mail.gmail.com> <8f2fd4aa050919121768d577a1@mail.gmail.com> <925d175605091912523f60e105@mail.gmail.com> <8f2fd4aa05091913045c8f582@mail.gmail.com> <925d175605091913312603b4d3@mail.gmail.com> X-Spam-Score: -2.5 (--) X-archive-position: 10617 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: brandon@yrick.com X-list: lojban-list X-Spam-Score: -2.5 (--) To: lojban@yahoogroups.com X-Originating-IP: 64.81.49.134 X-eGroups-Msg-Info: 1:12:0:0 X-eGroups-From: Brandon Wirick From: Brandon Wirick Reply-To: brandon@yrick.com Subject: [lojban] Re: Wheels in my Head X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=116389790; y=F6nQuNuaUUnJbpNc_KReXrwEbP7Aose67e1n9wBOxfUs90KaYA X-Yahoo-Profile: lojban_out X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 25000 Unless someone else has a really bright idea, I'm going to abandon this pursuit in favor of a more UTF-8-like approach: use one byte for simple syllables, two bytes for normal syllables, and three bytes for complex syllables, reserving a few bits in the first byte to tell how many bytes follow. First bits: 0 - 1 byte, from 00 to 7F 10 - 2 bytes from 8000 to BFFF 110 - three bytes from C00000 to DFFFFF There are then 0x204080 (over two million) possible numbers to assign to syllables. Actually, because less than 50,000 of them are valid, a 16-bit syllable table could be directly formed by ordering valid Lojban syllables according to this numbering system and assigning them a new number based on their place in the order. On 9/19/05, Jorge Llambías wrote: > On 9/19/05, Brandon Wirick wrote: > > Wait, what about {.uAcintyn.}? I don't see any convention for > > diphthongs that start with {ibu} or {ubu}. > > That's why I said for the most complex type of syllable, > which are the most numerous. (Maybe complex is not > the right word because they can be quite simple. The > most common type, perhaps.) > > That doesn't cover consonantal syllables, syllables > with affricate onset (tca, tsen, djau, dzoi), syllables with > semiconsonant onset (ua, bie, niai) and syllables with > an apostrophe onset ('a, 'ik, 'ei, 'aub). These should be > somehow squeezed in the holes left by the general > system. > > mu'o mi'e xorxes > > > > > On 9/19/05, Jorge Llambías wrote: > > > On 9/19/05, Brandon Wirick wrote: > > > > This is great! I had no idea such work existed. My task will be > > > > difficult, however, to sensibly encode these syllables into sixteen > > > > bits. > > > > > > Dificult, yes. With 17 bits, the most complex type could be > > > encoded as: > > > > > > 1 bit: stressed, unstressed > > > 1 bit: voiced onset, unvoiced onset > > > 2 bits: -, c/j, s/z > > > 3 bits: -, p/b, k/g, t/d, f/v, x, m, n > > > 2 bits: -, l, r > > > 4 bits: a, e, i, o, u, ai, au, ei, oi, y > > > 4 bits: -, c/j, s/z, p/b, k/g, t/d, f/v, x, m, n, l, r > > > > > > (the voicedness of the coda is determined by the > > > voiceness of the following syllable, not by that of the onset, > > > obviously.) > > > > > > Then the other types of syllables, which are simpler, can > > > be encoded in the holes left by this scheme. But 16 bits... > > > it seems hard. > > > > > > mu'o mi'e xorxes > > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org > > > with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if > > > you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help. > > > > > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org > > with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if > > you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help. > > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org > with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if > you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help. > > To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help.