From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Mon Mar 20 16:13:03 2006 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Mon, 20 Mar 2006 16:13:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1FLUUP-0002a9-0Z for lojban-list-real@lojban.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2006 16:12:45 -0800 Received: from smtp.mail.umich.edu ([141.211.93.160] helo=skycaptain.mr.itd.umich.edu) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1FLUUL-0002a2-OD for lojban-list@lojban.org; Mon, 20 Mar 2006 16:12:44 -0800 Received: FROM centipede.gpcc.itd.umich.edu (centipede.gpcc.itd.umich.edu [141.211.2.212]) BY skycaptain.mr.itd.umich.edu ID 441F44F7.F3135.25660 ; 20 Mar 2006 19:12:40 -0500 Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2006 19:12:39 -0500 (EST) From: Alex Joseph Martini X-X-Sender: alexjm@centipede.gpcc.itd.umich.edu To: lojban-list@lojban.org Subject: [lojban] Re: semantic primes In-Reply-To: <20060320212758.21818.qmail@web81303.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: References: <20060320212758.21818.qmail@web81303.mail.mud.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed X-Spam-Score: -2.6 (--) X-archive-position: 11188 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: alexjm@umich.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-list@lojban.org X-list: lojban-list to de'i li 20 pi'e 3 pi'e 2006 la'e zoi gy. John E Clifford gy. ciska toi > I worry about this: it seems to say "in the actual frame of reference > of someone who might be looking at the mountain" (but, ex hypothesi, > is not), which would miss the point. I think that moving the {da'i} > out to scope the whole sentence works nicely: "the ball would be on > the right of the tree for someone looking at the mountain (with all > xorxes quite correct assumptions)." The other possibility would be to > bury the {lo catlu be lo cmana} behind {tu'a} and leave the details to > be worked out later. Byt the way, is there a regular distinction > between "on Billy's right" and "to the right of Billy"? > > [ li'o ] In normal English usage, "on Billy's right" means 'on the same side of Billy's body as Billy's right hand is'. "To the right of Billy" means either Billy's or someone else's right side is being used for reference. Here, the thing being referenced could be on the side with Billy's left hand, but with the speaker's right hand, if the speaker and Billy are facing one another. This second case is inherently ambiguous without the visual context that we would normally have when speaking. mu'omi'e .aleks. To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help.