From lojban-out@lojban.org Sat Aug 19 14:21:53 2006 Return-Path: X-Sender: lojban-out@lojban.org X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 5672 invoked from network); 19 Aug 2006 21:21:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.67.34) by m36.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 19 Aug 2006 21:21:52 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO chain.digitalkingdom.org) (64.81.49.134) by mta8.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 19 Aug 2006 21:21:52 -0000 Received: from lojban-out by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.62) (envelope-from ) id 1GEYDH-0000dQ-Su for lojban@yahoogroups.com; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 14:18:40 -0700 Received: from chain.digitalkingdom.org ([64.81.49.134]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.62) (envelope-from ) id 1GEYBt-0000cR-Jb; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 14:17:16 -0700 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Sat, 19 Aug 2006 14:17:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.62) (envelope-from ) id 1GEYBS-0000bx-3g for lojban-list-real@lojban.org; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 14:16:46 -0700 Received: from mxsf23.cluster1.charter.net ([209.225.28.223]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.62) (envelope-from ) id 1GEYBO-0000bp-Ka for lojban-list@lojban.org; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 14:16:45 -0700 Received: from mxip27a.cluster1.charter.net (mxip27a.cluster1.charter.net [209.225.28.184]) by mxsf23.cluster1.charter.net (8.12.11.20060308/8.12.11) with ESMTP id k7JLGccu002544 for ; Sat, 19 Aug 2006 17:16:39 -0400 Received: from 66-188-5-53.dhcp.bycy.mi.charter.com (HELO [192.168.123.137]) ([66.188.5.53]) by mxip27a.cluster1.charter.net with ESMTP; 19 Aug 2006 17:16:38 -0400 X-IronPort-AV: i="4.08,148,1154923200"; d="scan'208,217"; a="1536658631:sNHT28737572" Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) In-Reply-To: <12d58c160608191328m51d693c5n1c7b14022acbedb1@mail.gmail.com> References: <38903270.20060819143600@mail.ru> <44E710A1.6070804@lojban.org> <200608190832.18950.tim.thelion@gmail.com> <12d58c160608191328m51d693c5n1c7b14022acbedb1@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-1--526141352 Message-Id: <2DD80B5D-EFA0-4049-ACBE-DE5FAAC77C64@umich.edu> Date: Sat, 19 Aug 2006 17:16:41 -0400 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-Spam-Score: -2.4 (--) X-archive-position: 12503 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: alexjm@umich.edu X-list: lojban-list X-Spam-Score: -2.4 (--) To: lojban@yahoogroups.com X-Originating-IP: 64.81.49.134 X-eGroups-From: Alex Martini From: Alex Martini Reply-To: alexjm@umich.edu Subject: [lojban] Re: No Italy X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=116389790; y=KRuH6kRk4rSCA5ADR9iAPBmX24n_kcMbJv8HwelnFXIgd66zMw X-Yahoo-Profile: lojban_out X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 26933 --Apple-Mail-1--526141352 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed ki'e for filling in the Latin -- I was reaching a bit beyond my solid knowledge here. And nitpicking is just about the favourite hobby in the forum. Especially about gadri. (zo'o) mu'omi'e.aleks. On Aug 19, 2006, at 4:28 PM, komfo,amonan wrote: > On 8/19/06, Alex Martini wrote: > Actually, neither is a dialect of the other. Italian, French, > Portugese, Spanish, and the other Romance languages are more like > siblings than dialects of eachother. In the beginning, there was > Classical Latin -- the 'proper' or 'formal' Latin of the Roman > conquerors, from which came Vernacular Latin (also called Vulgar > Latin) -- the Latin of the common people. As it mixed with the local > dying languages, it formed dialects which became less and less like > eachother over time. Spanish got a heavy dallop of Arabic mixed in, > which the others missed, from being occupied by the Moors. > > Allow me to nitpick here. Before there was Classical Latin, there > was Archaic Latin. Writings in Archaic Latin were not readily > readable to one familiar with Classical (even during the Classical > period). Spoken Archaic Latin evolved into Vulgar Latin. Classical > Latin was an inentionally highly-structured, somewhat florid > version of the language used for official texts, literature, and > public speeches. It is thought to have arisen early in the Vulgar > Latin period, say around 250 BCE. A good modern analog would be the > distinction between Modern Standard Arabic, a kind of formalized, > Qur'an-based language used in official contexts across the Arab > world; and Vernacular Arabic, which varies widely from country to > country and from the standard. mu'o mi'e komfo,amonan --Apple-Mail-1--526141352 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 ki'e=A0for filling in the Latin -- I was = reaching a bit beyond my solid knowledge here.

And nitpicking is just about the favourite hobby i= n the forum. Especially about gadri. (zo'o)

mu'omi'e.aleks.

On Aug 19, 20= 06, at 4:28 PM, komfo,amonan wrote:

On 8/19/06, A= lex Martini <alexjm@umich.edu> wrote:
Actually, neither is a dialect of the o= ther. Italian, French,
Portugese, Spanish, and the other Romance languag= es are more like
siblings than dialects of eachother. In the beginning, = there was
Classical Latin -- the 'proper' or 'formal' Latin of the Roman=
conquerors, from which came Vernacular Latin (also called Vulgar
La= tin) -- the Latin of the common people. As it mixed with the local
dying la= nguages, it formed dialects which became less and less like
eachother ov= er time. Spanish got a heavy dallop of Arabic mixed in,
which the others= missed, from being occupied by the Moors.

Allow me to nitpick here. Before there was Classical Latin, there was Arc= haic Latin. Writings in Archaic Latin were not readily readable to one fami= liar with Classical (even during the Classical period). Spoken Archaic Lati= n evolved into Vulgar Latin. Classical Latin was an inentionally highly-str= uctured, somewhat florid version of the language used for official texts, l= iterature, and public speeches. It is thought to have arisen early in the V= ulgar Latin period, say around 250 BCE. A good modern analog would be the d= istinction between Modern Standard Arabic, a kind of formalized, Qur'an-bas= ed language used in official contexts across the Arab world; and Vernacular= Arabic, which varies widely from country to country and from the standard.= mu'o mi'e komfo,amonan

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