From lojban-out@lojban.org Wed Nov 08 20:54:52 2006 Return-Path: X-Sender: lojban-out@lojban.org X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 26740 invoked from network); 9 Nov 2006 04:53:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.67.33) by m37.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 9 Nov 2006 04:53:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO chain.digitalkingdom.org) (64.81.49.134) by mta7.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 9 Nov 2006 04:53:55 -0000 Received: from lojban-out by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1Gi1OY-0002oK-Q9 for lojban@yahoogroups.com; Wed, 08 Nov 2006 20:20:06 -0800 Received: from chain.digitalkingdom.org ([64.81.49.134]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1Gi1NE-0002mu-1c; Wed, 08 Nov 2006 20:18:48 -0800 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Wed, 08 Nov 2006 20:18:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1Gi1Mk-0002mg-QH for lojban-list-real@lojban.org; Wed, 08 Nov 2006 20:18:14 -0800 Received: from rlpowell by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1Gi1Mk-0002mZ-Hu for lojban-list@lojban.org; Wed, 08 Nov 2006 20:18:14 -0800 Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2006 20:18:14 -0800 Message-ID: <20061109041814.GE23121@chain.digitalkingdom.org> Mail-Followup-To: lojban-list@lojban.org References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11) X-archive-position: 12965 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: rlpowell@digitalkingdom.org X-list: lojban-list X-Spam-Score: -3.1 (---) To: lojban@yahoogroups.com X-Originating-IP: 64.81.49.134 X-eGroups-Msg-Info: 1:0:0:0 X-eGroups-From: Robin Lee Powell From: Robin Lee Powell Reply-To: rlpowell@digitalkingdom.org Subject: [lojban] Re: "la" in names X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=116389790; y=ZqMoM1BLZkoiLIcJOzzNv5cwD9NkGs0rk3ey8K5bXltw6Bmmzw X-Yahoo-Profile: lojban_out X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 27407 On Thu, Nov 09, 2006 at 06:40:28AM +0300, Yanis Batura wrote: > I don't understand you, people. You are not at all confused by the > fact that Lojban doesn't have VERY MANY sounds present in other > languages, but the fact that you can't spell your name exactly as > in English make you sick. > > Lojban doesn't allow {la}, {lai} and {doi} in names, and that's > all. If even almost everyone, including me, of course, cannot > adhere to this rule, that is our problem, and not the language's. > Just wait, and the sence of correct lojbanization will develop in > us. Not a single Lojbanist has *ever* internalized this rule. We know this because *every* major Lojbanist has made this mistake, and it showed up in "What Is Lojban?", which was proofread by at least 3 major Lojbanists. We have no evidence, at all, that anyone can internalize this rule. It's not about whether the rule is good or not. I don't mind in the slightest that "la" isn't allowed; that's the least of what we have to do to Lojbanize names. The problem is not what the rule requires, the problem is that *we can't follow it*, and we've *proven* we can't. A rule we can't follow that, in the not-following, breaks audio-visual isomorphism is, to me, a total travesty of one of the most important goals of the language. Whether someone gets to use the "la" sound in their name or not is totally irrelevant to my concerns. We're *breaking the language*, and it has to stop. -Robin -- http://www.digitalkingdom.org/~rlpowell/ *** http://www.lojban.org/ Reason #237 To Learn Lojban: "Homonyms: Their Grate!" Proud Supporter of the Singularity Institute - http://singinst.org/ To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help.