From lojban-out@lojban.org Sun Jan 07 05:58:15 2007 Return-Path: X-Sender: lojban-out@lojban.org X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com Received: (qmail 45856 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2007 13:58:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (66.218.66.216) by m20.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 7 Jan 2007 13:58:06 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO mail1.sea5.speakeasy.net) (69.17.117.3) by mta1.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 7 Jan 2007 13:57:59 -0000 Received: (qmail 6333 invoked from network); 7 Jan 2007 13:56:47 -0000 Received: from chain.digitalkingdom.org ([64.81.66.169]) (envelope-sender ) by mail1.sea5.speakeasy.net (qmail-ldap-1.03) with AES256-SHA encrypted SMTP for ; 7 Jan 2007 13:56:47 -0000 Received: from lojban-out by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1H3YVi-0000QZ-Ly for lojban@yahoogroups.com; Sun, 07 Jan 2007 05:56:33 -0800 Received: from chain.digitalkingdom.org ([64.81.66.169]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1H3YUL-0000Mn-F2; Sun, 07 Jan 2007 05:55:19 -0800 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Sun, 07 Jan 2007 05:53:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1H3YSK-0000LM-Mb for lojban-list-real@lojban.org; Sun, 07 Jan 2007 05:53:02 -0800 Received: from wx-out-0506.google.com ([66.249.82.224]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1H3YSC-0000KZ-Jd for lojban-list@lojban.org; Sun, 07 Jan 2007 05:52:58 -0800 Received: by wx-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id i30so10670112wxd for ; Sun, 07 Jan 2007 05:52:51 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.90.56.14 with SMTP id e14mr1613275aga.1168177971212; Sun, 07 Jan 2007 05:52:51 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.90.31.16 with HTTP; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 05:52:50 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3ccac5f10701070552o6995a1fetce44cc0fd724ee82@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2007 16:52:50 +0300 In-Reply-To: <925d17560701070458t7243c3a0n2368d08b771cd615@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <925d17560701060757o1c0b3914w2f28416a2858cb29@mail.gmail.com> <611088.72555.qm@web81308.mail.mud.yahoo.com> <925d17560701070458t7243c3a0n2368d08b771cd615@mail.gmail.com> X-Google-Sender-Auth: 83fb7b235a04ea7b X-Spam-Score: -2.6 X-Spam-Score-Int: -25 X-Spam-Bar: -- X-archive-position: 13522 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: slobin@ice.ru X-list: lojban-list X-Spam-Score: -2.6 X-Spam-Score-Int: -25 X-Spam-Bar: -- X-Spam-Report: Spam detection software, running on the system "chain.digitalkingdom.org", has identified this incoming email as possible spam. The original message has been attached to this so you can view it (if it isn't spam) or label similar future email. If you have any questions, see the administrator of that system for details. Content preview: coi xorxes > Since promises, requests and orders are events (albeit unrealized ones), > they can be referred to in Lojban with {lo nu ...}: {lo nu mi ba dunda > lo relselxi'u do}, {lo nu lo smuci cu nenri lo re moi dacru}. And we can also, > of course, refer to these unrealized events by other descriptions {lo se nupre}, > {lo se cpedu}, {lo se minde}, etc. [...] Content analysis details: (-2.6 points, 5.0 required) pts rule name description ---- ---------------------- -------------------------------------------------- 0.0 UNPARSEABLE_RELAY Informational: message has unparseable relay lines -2.6 BAYES_00 BODY: Bayesian spam probability is 0 to 1% [score: 0.0000] -0.0 AWL AWL: From: address is in the auto white-list To: lojban@yahoogroups.com X-Originating-IP: 69.17.117.3 X-eGroups-Msg-Info: 1:0:0:0 X-eGroups-From: "Cyril Slobin" From: "Cyril Slobin" Reply-To: slobin@ice.ru Subject: [lojban] Re: Duty, promice etc... X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=116389790; y=NxcD8iIuoT2o3PgIijZqrsfLOpAHF8p-MXDRP7TXjvJaJS3QxQ X-Yahoo-Profile: lojban_out X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 27961 coi xorxes > Since promises, requests and orders are events (albeit unrealized ones), > they can be referred to in Lojban with {lo nu ...}: {lo nu mi ba dunda > lo relselxi'u do}, {lo nu lo smuci cu nenri lo re moi dacru}. And we can also, > of course, refer to these unrealized events by other descriptions {lo se nupre}, > {lo se cpedu}, {lo se minde}, etc. I opine that "being an unrealized event" is event about event: {lo nu broda be lo nu brode}, where {lo nu brode} is event promised/requested/ordered and {lo nu broda} is the state of its unrealizedness.The good example of such {lo nu broda} is {lo nu bilga}. In fact {lo nu bilga} is a very general kind of unrealizedness (like "nu" is very general kind of event) - whether you have promise, request or order, you are in some or other way obliged to do so. I opine the event of promising, requesting and commanding ( {lo nu nupre}, {lo nu cpedu} and {lo nu minde}) are good for x3 of {bilga}. So, "I am bound by a promise" is {mi bilga lo nu mi brode lo nu mi nupre}. Because it is (or should be) a very common pattern, I suggest a series of lujvo in form {nupybilga} whith following place stucture: x1 = nupre1 = bilga1 "who is promised and therefore obliged", x2 = nupre2 = bilga2 "what is promiced and therefore obliged"; bilga3 = {le nu nupre} and omitteded from lujvo place structure, x3 = nupre3 "beneficiary/victim of a promise". ... noi se gusni fi le solri poi se cmene lu sa'u tarci li'u ... -- Cyril Slobin To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help.