From lojban-out@lojban.org Sat Dec 15 06:16:31 2007 Return-Path: X-Sender: lojban-out@lojban.org X-Apparently-To: lojban@yahoogroups.com X-Received: (qmail 54527 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2007 14:16:31 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (66.218.67.96) by m50.grp.scd.yahoo.com with QMQP; 15 Dec 2007 14:16:31 -0000 X-Received: from unknown (HELO mail5.sea5.speakeasy.net) (69.17.117.7) by mta17.grp.scd.yahoo.com with SMTP; 15 Dec 2007 14:16:31 -0000 X-Received: (qmail 8127 invoked from network); 15 Dec 2007 14:16:30 -0000 X-Received: from chain.digitalkingdom.org ([64.81.66.169]) (envelope-sender ) by mail5.sea5.speakeasy.net (qmail-ldap-1.03) with AES256-SHA encrypted SMTP for ; 15 Dec 2007 14:16:30 -0000 X-Received: from lojban-out by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.68) (envelope-from ) id 1J3XoR-00030j-Pe for lojban@yahoogroups.com; Sat, 15 Dec 2007 06:16:20 -0800 X-Received: from chain.digitalkingdom.org ([64.81.66.169]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.68) (envelope-from ) id 1J3Xo3-0002xW-QA; Sat, 15 Dec 2007 06:15:59 -0800 X-Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Sat, 15 Dec 2007 06:14:31 -0800 (PST) X-Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.68) (envelope-from ) id 1J3Xmg-0002xQ-U9 for lojban-list-real@lojban.org; Sat, 15 Dec 2007 06:14:31 -0800 X-Received: from fg-out-1718.google.com ([72.14.220.157]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.68) (envelope-from ) id 1J3Xmc-0002xC-HM for lojban-list@lojban.org; Sat, 15 Dec 2007 06:14:30 -0800 X-Received: by fg-out-1718.google.com with SMTP id e12so70384fga.0 for ; Sat, 15 Dec 2007 06:14:25 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 10.86.100.7 with SMTP id x7mr4208719fgb.78.1197728064923; Sat, 15 Dec 2007 06:14:24 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 10.86.86.13 with HTTP; Sat, 15 Dec 2007 06:14:24 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <925d17560712150614x1444b543qdfbbb6b5bfc76219@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2007 11:14:24 -0300 In-Reply-To: <97f5058c0712141559s7e303235s9f29320bd1922172@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline References: <97f5058c0712042002q563a1ebercc15fe68a57f2210@mail.gmail.com> <925d17560712051059v3b83f3e6ieee1e1aed2a7f6db@mail.gmail.com> <97f5058c0712141553gac4b952qcbd2c7610a83308e@mail.gmail.com> <97f5058c0712141559s7e303235s9f29320bd1922172@mail.gmail.com> X-Spam-Score: 0.0 X-Spam-Score-Int: 0 X-Spam-Bar: / X-archive-position: 14005 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: jjllambias@gmail.com X-list: lojban-list X-Spam-Score: 0.0 X-Spam-Score-Int: 0 X-Spam-Bar: / To: lojban@yahoogroups.com X-Originating-IP: 69.17.117.7 X-eGroups-Msg-Info: 1:12:0:0:0 X-eGroups-From: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jorge_Llamb=EDas?=" From: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jorge_Llamb=EDas?=" Reply-To: jjllambias@gmail.com Subject: [lojban] Re: "This number" X-Yahoo-Group-Post: member; u=116389790; y=TE1Kef384yXKr_DaiAljNeQrlYmKOE03H83ItLXpGZwFwD8tqw X-Yahoo-Profile: lojban_out X-Yahoo-Message-Num: 28484 On Dec 14, 2007 8:59 PM, Penguino wrote: > Thus the first example goes to "mi nitcu paza'u pinsi", and the second "la > .aslan. djica su'oza'u narge". But I don't think that's really what "more" means in the original. Consider this other example: "I will buy one more pencil." That does not mean that I will buy a number of pencils that is equal to "some established number plus one". I will buy a single pencil. The other pencils I already have, I either already bought them, or I got them by some other means. Using {za'u} you could say: mi ba te vecnu lo za'u moi pinsi I will buy an other-than-first pencil. i.e. "other than first" in some unspecified order, for example the order in which I got them. In your examples with "want" and "need" it is pehaps less clear, because if you need one more presumably you also need the ones you already have and if Aslan wants some more presumably he also wants/wanted the ones he already has/had. But "I want one more pencil" and "Aslan wants some more nuts" doesn't strictly assert anything about the previous pencils/nuts, it only presupposes that you have them/Aslan had them. >The interaction between multiple inexact > numbers might have to be worked out, but in this case it is unambiguous. "At > least two more" would be su'oreza'u, which would be the same whether > interpreted as (su'ore)za'u or su'o(reza'u) If {za'u} were to be used that way, then it would be a kind of indicator. {reza'u broda} would mean two broda, which are in some sense added to some other broda already present in the context but which are not arguments of the current bridi. Perhaps {ji'a} is more appropriate for that: mi nitcu pa ji'a pinsi la .aslan. cu djica su'o ji'a narge mu'o mi'e xorxes To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help.