From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Sun Sep 07 12:18:11 2008 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Sun, 07 Sep 2008 12:18:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1KcPly-00048K-Va for lojban-list-real@lojban.org; Sun, 07 Sep 2008 12:18:11 -0700 Received: from ug-out-1314.google.com ([66.249.92.173]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1KcPls-00047J-AO for lojban-list@lojban.org; Sun, 07 Sep 2008 12:18:10 -0700 Received: by ug-out-1314.google.com with SMTP id p35so292427ugc.36 for ; Sun, 07 Sep 2008 12:18:03 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:subject:from:to:in-reply-to :references:content-type:date:message-id:mime-version:x-mailer :content-transfer-encoding; bh=7nGtlPg5vDC9UKNveJg0+x1oZFEkrD9VURymrg7VuBc=; b=w5cUULbuHKJXHvjfYtrUHlt6PJOyU53Porfg/sA9tF7i5IVBsbXjd/btrKLYKIieLt PNi2Dqy/XTFkXg6ZWmFyplioF3mh3YFPWK7uXIuLqYNCFGBP3oZ9RI3wJr761iuFQrVm cHE4wwdtUakpq41NHjbrQDAIGXvOCAH/Tgsww= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=subject:from:to:in-reply-to:references:content-type:date:message-id :mime-version:x-mailer:content-transfer-encoding; b=gm4NU9cgU+v393ZPQWsEh6701Y2O8gaFQkuzo0zmDO7C96tEARFRJU0lQB+gPXreuJ VKj3X8LKtohl3HXQFjD8+lt5WWqRJ/yN4jdb1xbscSQIOFw0plZ4G6tmxCt3NFGP7zNK IxwgfDgMOdc2ioPFCPcQO9VdON3NA2jkkC8rs= Received: by 10.67.32.18 with SMTP id k18mr3168527ugj.26.1220815082314; Sun, 07 Sep 2008 12:18:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ?192.168.4.234? ( [62.251.21.22]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id k30sm1771325ugc.53.2008.09.07.12.18.00 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Sun, 07 Sep 2008 12:18:00 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [lojban] Re: How to spread the word From: Auke Booij To: lojban-list@lojban.org In-Reply-To: <737b61f30809051604w686071aetec61ac634dcc16dc@mail.gmail.com> References: <1220648242.3538.15.camel@tulcod-desky> <737b61f30809051604w686071aetec61ac634dcc16dc@mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain Date: Sun, 07 Sep 2008 21:17:58 +0200 Message-Id: <1220815078.3602.37.camel@tulcod-desky> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.22.3.1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: -0.0 X-Spam-Score-Int: 0 X-Spam-Bar: / X-archive-position: 14709 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: auke.booij@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-list@lojban.org X-list: lojban-list On Fri, 2008-09-05 at 18:04 -0500, Chris Capel wrote: > As someone who does not speak fluently, or even all that well, but who > has actually studied most of Lojban in depth, I find the idea that > Lojban would have any major advantages for scientific articles to be > dubious. Language is simply not a roadblock in communication in > science, except insofar as there is more than one language in the > world. And while I think Lojban would be a great candidate for an > interlingua, that's really a completely separate argument. > > I wonder if you could be more specific about how you see English (or > German) falling down as a language for scientific discourse. How is > science materially harmed by the disadvantages English has compared to > Lojban? > > Chris Capel Good question. To me, the biggest difference lies near the philosophical and metaphysical field, where people often talk about undefined ideas. And then they come to strange conclusions. Trying to write this e-mail, it appears to be hard for me to find good examples, while I experience inconsistencies in scientific texts every day. So far, the only thing I can say is that Lojban forces you to choose your words correctly, and, of course, evades ambiguity (which is generally not a problem). On Sun, 2008-09-07 at 10:24 -0700, arpgme wrote: > Re: How to spread the word > > Author: arpgme > > I suggest making/translating blogs, websites, games, and programs into > Lojban. Also, people should start subtitling videos into Lojban and do > covers/fan-dubs into Lojban. In my opinion, this is the best way to > get the average person to know about Lojban. It seems that most > Lojbanists are trying to get other linguists to know about Lojban but > we should also target the general public, too. Thus, letting much more > people know and get interested in Lojban. Ironically, I got to know about Lojban because of an xkcd strip. Since I tried esperanto a few years back too, I thought it'd be interesting to see what this "yet another" interlanguage had to offer. But then again, there's also a lot of people who don't bother learning a different language. I think a lot of americans are content with English, sometimes plus one other language (usually spanish). Why would they suddenly bother learning Lojban? I think we initially need to have something to offer, something not available in a different language. And then try to get attention. Esperanto got famous because it pretty much is spanish with a few modifications, so it was easy for people to learn. Similarly, Italian looks *a lot* like Latin, hence most people who had Latin will have few trouble reading Italian. But Lojban is a completely different language. With a reason. But what reason? That's unknown to pretty much the entire world minus the handful enlightened ones amongst us who learned Lojban. tulcod. To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help.