From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Mon Mar 09 02:24:43 2009 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Mon, 09 Mar 2009 02:24:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Lgbj1-0007jn-MC for lojban-list-real@lojban.org; Mon, 09 Mar 2009 02:24:43 -0700 Received: from mail-ew0-f173.google.com ([209.85.219.173]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Lgbiz-0007jJ-0r for lojban-list@lojban.org; Mon, 09 Mar 2009 02:24:43 -0700 Received: by ewy21 with SMTP id 21so663531ewy.34 for ; Mon, 09 Mar 2009 02:24:34 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:received:date:message-id:subject :from:to:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=ctICSMZ8eMeo7DX37f2C2XebZZt0WxaUb2+I/UFcwAI=; b=RWSTTFCV7tdiGYYYPCMArjmrxnTY0S5gOcC9jIuhAPczhgrKY89klG7gQMUis8Ca5L BrqpF+EQxWK9dvPVgx8WUichyBwamShf3rg5Lu/yw0wcl47zJ66Ac1SP4F4540+RKwmV 4UCqVMjU7OI6oC+rE5s8053qVat5h2+yYczHo= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; b=UYxraBh5XfNR1N9EX4ofyQtPFS0guYGGmJGpU69/jyBS3wtj3ZqDNDEzG9VJak3Zni 4h6m+rGoYtL+Bd6exUAHE1PtxzGLKzNkvcggD/1P77Lbin2HfG660O4/2KuWFQ/kjKsa PqO9ztEexVyhjQxIE/9rEwJ1aJkFjA64Ilw94= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.216.26.202 with SMTP id c52mr1971761wea.98.1236590673719; Mon, 09 Mar 2009 02:24:33 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2009 10:24:33 +0100 Message-ID: <4de8c3930903090224w1b2c4f4fybc7cf188aa2e8972@mail.gmail.com> Subject: [lojban] place structure and frame semantics From: tijlan To: lojban-list@lojban.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.0 X-Spam-Score-Int: 0 X-Spam-Bar: / X-archive-position: 15353 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: pascal.akihiko@gmail.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-list@lojban.org X-list: lojban-list An excerpt from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frame_semantics_(linguistics) : -------------------------------------------------------------------- The basic idea is that one cannot understand the meaning of a single word without access to all the essential knowledge that relates to that word. For example, one would not be able to understand the word "sell" without knowing anything about the situation of commercial transfer, which also involves, among other things, a seller, a buyer, goods, money, the relation between the money and the goods, the relations between the seller and the goods and the money, the relation between the buyer and the goods and the money and so on. Thus, a word activates, or evokes, a frame of semantic knowledge relating to the specific concept it refers to (or highlights, in frame semantic terminology). A semantic frame is defined as a coherent structure of related concepts that are related such that without knowledge of all of them, one does not have complete knowledge of one of the either, and are in that sense types of gestalt. -------------------------------------------------------------------- I think this is explicitly exemplified in the way we use Lojban selbri such as "vecnu", which requires that we have knowledge of (at least some of) its arguments or the valency (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valency_(linguistics)). But this is what follows: -------------------------------------------------------------------- Frames are based on recurring experiences. So the commercial transaction frame is based on recurring experiences of commercial transaction. -------------------------------------------------------------------- What can we say about this 'recurring experiences' in regard to the Lojban selbri, the frame (or place structure) of which is prescriptively defined and not experience-based? mu'o mi'e tijlan To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help.