From nobody@digitalkingdom.org Mon Aug 24 18:48:08 2009 Received: with ECARTIS (v1.0.0; list lojban-list); Mon, 24 Aug 2009 18:48:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from nobody by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Mfl8m-0007FZ-KP for lojban-list-real@lojban.org; Mon, 24 Aug 2009 18:48:07 -0700 Received: from imr-da06.mx.aol.com ([205.188.169.203]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Mfl8c-0007Et-O8 for lojban-list@lojban.org; Mon, 24 Aug 2009 18:48:03 -0700 Received: from imo-ma02.mx.aol.com (imo-ma02.mx.aol.com [64.12.78.137]) by imr-da06.mx.aol.com (8.14.1/8.14.1) with ESMTP id n7P1lZxk012347 for ; Mon, 24 Aug 2009 21:47:35 -0400 Received: from MorphemeAddict@wmconnect.com by imo-ma02.mx.aol.com (mail_out_v42.5.) id d.bdf.5936b42c (30739) for ; Mon, 24 Aug 2009 21:47:31 -0400 (EDT) From: MorphemeAddict@wmconnect.com Message-ID: Date: Mon, 24 Aug 2009 21:47:31 EDT Subject: [lojban] Re: How many possible gismu? To: lojban-list@lojban.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_bdf.5936b42c.37c49cb3_boundary" X-Mailer: 6.0 for Windows XP sub 11501 X-Spam-Flag:NO X-AOL-SENDER: MorphemeAddict@wmconnect.com X-archive-position: 16008 X-ecartis-version: Ecartis v1.0.0 Sender: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org Errors-to: lojban-list-bounce@lojban.org X-original-sender: MorphemeAddict@wmconnect.com Precedence: bulk Reply-to: lojban-list@lojban.org X-list: lojban-list --part1_bdf.5936b42c.37c49cb3_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 8/24/2009 21:08:35 Eastern Daylight Time, fagricipni@gmail.com writes: > I agree that even at the rate at which I am imagining new gismu to be > created -- which may be ridiculously high -- there would be no actual > problem in this regard for millennia. However, even though I can write > a program to implementing the brute force algorithm that I have been > able to come up with to answer my second question -- What is the > _smallest_ number of gismu that could fill gismu space, starting > from an empty gismu space? -- the program would based on my initial > guess be O(n!); I don't expect that the program would finish in my > lifetime. The first question -- What is the _smallest_ number > of new gismu that could fill up gismu space? -- might not be > answerable except by the brute-force approach; but there has got to > be a better way to answer the second -- What is the _smallest_ > number of gismu that could fill gismu space, starting from an empty > gismu space? -- I've just not thought of it. Consider that question > as a mathematical puzzle question with the rules for Lojban being the > set-up for the question; one doesn't have to consider what inspired > me to ask the question; I mentioned because I thought the notion of > what inspired me to ask that question would be interesting, _not_ > because I thought that it had any real _practical_ applications -- > Mathematicians look for higher and higher pairs of amicable numbers > (http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amicable_numbers) but as far as > I know it is not for practical applications of them. > This is an interesting problem. Doing it by hand might take a few days or a week or two. How do you get O(n!) for it? stevo --part1_bdf.5936b42c.37c49cb3_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable In a messag= e dated 8/24/2009 21:08:35 Eastern Daylight Time, fagricipni@gmail.com wri= tes:


I agree that even at th= e rate at which I am imagining new gismu to be
created -- which may be ridiculously high -- there would be no actual
problem in this regard for millennia.  However, even though I can= write
a program to implementing the brute force algorithm that I have been
able to come up with to answer my second question -- What is the
_smallest_ number of gismu that could fill gismu space, starting
from an empty gismu space? -- the program would based on my initial
guess be O(n!); I don't expect that the program would finish in my
lifetime.  The first question -- What is the _smallest_ number
of new gismu that could fill up gismu space? -- might not be
answerable except by the brute-force approach; but there has got to
be a better way to answer the second -- What is the _smallest_
number of gismu that could fill gismu space, starting from an empty
gismu space? -- I've just not thought of it.  Consider that quest= ion
as a mathematical puzzle question with the rules for Lojban being the
set-up for the question; one doesn't have to consider what inspired
me to ask the question; I mentioned because I thought the notion of
what inspired me to ask that question would be interesting, _not_
because I thought that it had any real _practical_ applications --
Mathematicians look for higher and higher pairs of amicable numbers
(http://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amicable_numbers) but as far as
I know it is not for practical applications of them.


This is an interesting problem.  Doing it by hand might take a fe= w days or a week or two.  How do you get O(n!) for it?

stevo --part1_bdf.5936b42c.37c49cb3_boundary-- To unsubscribe from this list, send mail to lojban-list-request@lojban.org with the subject unsubscribe, or go to http://www.lojban.org/lsg2/, or if you're really stuck, send mail to secretary@lojban.org for help.