From 3TniySwgSBsQ1vzy6ovvnsqs3kvusxqnyw.y1qvytlkxqyyqvoq1y4z2.myw@groups.bounces.google.com Tue Mar 30 15:17:12 2010 Received: from mail-pz0-f155.google.com ([209.85.222.155]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from <3TniySwgSBsQ1vzy6ovvnsqs3kvusxqnyw.y1qvytlkxqyyqvoq1y4z2.myw@groups.bounces.google.com>) id 1NwjkB-0004Ym-Tp for lojban-list-archive@lojban.org; Tue, 30 Mar 2010 15:17:12 -0700 Received: by pzk27 with SMTP id 27sf1965199pzk.2 for ; Tue, 30 Mar 2010 15:17:01 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:received:received:received:date:from:to :subject:message-id:references:mime-version:in-reply-to:user-agent :x-original-authentication-results:x-original-sender:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :x-thread-url:x-message-url:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe :content-type:content-disposition; bh=QOdYjRDSYBue8bFiA6qvujS9x+0rfUXnEb07bJS3g08=; b=Ab0zkQN136tdE+sK0WMBGd6nVp3dix+oZ3SaDnr4psIqmpdQe0fbopznh79R0g+8mF zGoE0Da6cC1hMKFRGcOZUyy5keDKfVqJQSIklmSDFgJvEJOUl51p0qO5D+cPg7T8CYxL iMWRsKO2g2h8OmdF1xB6QDHYEzUdjdFXEUQDU= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:date:from:to:subject:message-id:references :mime-version:in-reply-to:user-agent :x-original-authentication-results:x-original-sender:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :x-thread-url:x-message-url:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe :content-type:content-disposition; b=lGWYztOXIgg8wM0ilpgcvCC6U/6vxrtaJp52zotaeZ1au8ILsLWOSvfZGdUyPUgKvQ 7D8I5Uvs2j2MR8QBIy3Yo+6OIXz1teju98FZDCqCqEAcgAXUFu2dpbT9ly/zItEEkUga S75YAzntD3S2ASsPL23yPAHx9ls7kIRwok6Hw= Received: by 10.140.238.10 with SMTP id l10mr240482rvh.27.1269987406649; Tue, 30 Mar 2010 15:16:46 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.140.255.17 with SMTP id c17ls3244rvi.2.p; Tue, 30 Mar 2010 15:16:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.141.124.4 with SMTP id b4mr1133031rvn.8.1269987405365; Tue, 30 Mar 2010 15:16:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.141.124.4 with SMTP id b4mr1133030rvn.8.1269987405342; Tue, 30 Mar 2010 15:16:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail8.sea5.speakeasy.net (mail8.sea5.speakeasy.net [69.17.117.10]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id 24si1298781pzk.9.2010.03.30.15.16.45; Tue, 30 Mar 2010 15:16:45 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: neutral (google.com: 69.17.117.10 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of rlpowell@digitalkingdom.org) client-ip=69.17.117.10; Received: (qmail 17528 invoked from network); 30 Mar 2010 22:16:44 -0000 Received: from chain.digitalkingdom.org ([64.81.66.169]) (envelope-sender ) by mail8.sea5.speakeasy.net (qmail-ldap-1.03) with AES256-SHA encrypted SMTP for ; 30 Mar 2010 22:16:44 -0000 Received: from rlpowell by chain.digitalkingdom.org with local (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Nwjjm-0004X1-Nz for lojban@googlegroups.com; Tue, 30 Mar 2010 15:16:43 -0700 Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2010 15:16:42 -0700 From: Robin Lee Powell To: lojban@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: [lojban] Michael Everson, What Do You Want From Us? Message-ID: <20100330221642.GC6084@digitalkingdom.org> References: <009D3D10-8631-4E7E-943E-A64F9BA43478@mac.com> <23298cb41003301358m1bfeb3d7jfe28bcabb16ae5d6@mail.gmail.com> <23298cb41003301428n4916c3cfx6e57889c50e84785@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <23298cb41003301428n4916c3cfx6e57889c50e84785@mail.gmail.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.20 (2009-06-14) X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=neutral (google.com: 69.17.117.10 is neither permitted nor denied by best guess record for domain of rlpowell@digitalkingdom.org) smtp.mail=rlpowell@digitalkingdom.org X-Original-Sender: rlpowell@digitalkingdom.org Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: X-Thread-Url: http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/t/b548fd0eaf4c6a85 X-Message-Url: http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/msg/43295afff086f544 Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 11:28:07PM +0200, Remo Dentato wrote: > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 11:14 PM, Matt Arnold > wrote: > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 10:58:02PM +0200, Remo Dentato wrote: > > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 10:53 PM, Matt Arnold wrote: > > > > > > > Let the discussion happen. I'm not stomping on it, > > > > > > Thanks for your gracious concession! I feel much relieved we > > > can have a discussion! > > > > Seriously? You think you need permission? Don't paint yourself > > as a victim of tyranny in this scenario. > > That was not the intent. It was just a way to highlight how > pretentious was your tone in asking Michael about "what does he > wants". I might not need permission to discuss but it seems he > owes you a justification. What he was *asking* was whether there was a reason that he, as LLG President, needs to keep up with a *huge* email thread (I myself stopped reading it about two days ago; I simply have too many other demands on my time). > Seriously, your post is full of negative and aggressive sentences. And your response to Matt's clarification was incredibly rude. If you can't comprehend why someone would need to ignore a multi-hundred mail thread in favour of other things, I can only hope that your life will continue to be such a bastion of free time. On the other hand, Matt and I between us do all the work around here that no-one wants to do (he does book fulfillment, and I do book-keeping and site maintenance), and we're both incredibly busy. I routinely have to choose between fixing Lojban problems and doing the work I'm actually paid for and eating a meal, because I don't have time for all three. So, while I'm aware that Matt's original post was more than a little harsh, I thought his clarification was just fine (he needs to know if this is a priority for him to stay on top of as LLG president), and you should cut him some slack. > Don't try to paint yourself as victim of boring, pointless and > uninteresting discussions since nobody forces you to be part of > it. Actually, they *do* force him to be a part of it: as Presdient, it's his job to know what's going on in the community. He was asking, quite reasonably (if not in a terribly reasonable fashion), for a "get out of gigantic discussion free" card. Matt: In general, if you need to know about something, I'm sure someone will tell you. Feel free to drop out of discussions whenever; I certainly do. -Robin -- They say: "The first AIs will be built by the military as weapons." And I'm thinking: "Does it even occur to you to try for something other than the default outcome?" See http://shrunklink.com/cdiz http://www.digitalkingdom.org/~rlpowell/ *** http://www.lojban.org/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban?hl=en.