From 3YayzSwoJBg0wwyynzovn5tznvy.p1zy1won0t11tyrt41725.p1z@groups.bounces.google.com Wed Mar 31 13:11:40 2010 Received: from mail-vw0-f61.google.com ([209.85.212.61]) by chain.digitalkingdom.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from <3YayzSwoJBg0wwyynzovn5tznvy.p1zy1won0t11tyrt41725.p1z@groups.bounces.google.com>) id 1Nx4GE-0004eB-TN for lojban-list-archive@lojban.org; Wed, 31 Mar 2010 13:11:40 -0700 Received: by vws1 with SMTP id 1sf1073136vws.16 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2010 13:11:28 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:x-beenthere:received:received:received :received:received-spf:received:mime-version:received:in-reply-to :references:date:received:message-id:subject:from:to :x-original-authentication-results:x-original-sender:reply-to :precedence:mailing-list:list-id:list-post:list-help:list-archive :x-thread-url:x-message-url:sender:list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=tqGQwSr5QxqU+LS5DiSgKea5h8Xd/iRzIAGTAwiizTs=; b=ZdeeMRcaTMHKis6HRKXxIg7LS3wJsbmT7AwWto4RrX5oYJgrkJW+bzO8vw6NxVExTZ erHSJpdFKFR+lrQQ7ZN4Is01W/RxGa7PaRPF2fiL2zTIDhExiXcZwGyzoOkHPO81fW/F oN+5/ZcJg4COUuR6EeDG0neMK1V6mbhpia+Vw= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=googlegroups.com; s=beta; h=x-beenthere:received-spf:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:x-original-authentication-results :x-original-sender:reply-to:precedence:mailing-list:list-id :list-post:list-help:list-archive:x-thread-url:x-message-url:sender :list-subscribe:list-unsubscribe:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; b=ob72l5w25jluJQpj/n7n9luHV8dV0AfMaKX8SM8uOwMatb2xMQxK9c8jAAIV1TZvZE ckCB//uQpc46OEBGRWmXnWV2yXQw23LOrBUBEZCf9HfFGlJsnts9PdRpf5HjWMpSPBpO IhOjjA9DbRivSCXzTQSw2j4HyAZRmotm0T6oE= Received: by 10.220.122.78 with SMTP id k14mr20670vcr.10.1270066274001; Wed, 31 Mar 2010 13:11:14 -0700 (PDT) X-BeenThere: lojban@googlegroups.com Received: by 10.220.79.3 with SMTP id n3ls203701vck.3.p; Wed, 31 Mar 2010 13:11:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.220.4.37 with SMTP id 37mr2134490vcp.16.1270066273079; Wed, 31 Mar 2010 13:11:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.220.4.37 with SMTP id 37mr2134489vcp.16.1270066273058; Wed, 31 Mar 2010 13:11:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from qw-out-2122.google.com (qw-out-2122.google.com [74.125.92.25]) by gmr-mx.google.com with ESMTP id 21si17124764vws.1.2010.03.31.13.11.11; Wed, 31 Mar 2010 13:11:12 -0700 (PDT) Received-SPF: pass (google.com: domain of jjllambias@gmail.com designates 74.125.92.25 as permitted sender) client-ip=74.125.92.25; Received: by qw-out-2122.google.com with SMTP id 3so147104qwe.17 for ; Wed, 31 Mar 2010 13:11:11 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.229.91.67 with HTTP; Wed, 31 Mar 2010 13:11:11 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <4BB3A8E7.3000500@gmail.com> References: <4BB3921C.50308@lojban.org> <4BB3A8E7.3000500@gmail.com> Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2010 17:11:11 -0300 Received: by 10.229.218.2 with SMTP id ho2mr616061qcb.51.1270066271776; Wed, 31 Mar 2010 13:11:11 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: Subject: Re: [lojban] Summary: Cultural fu'ivla From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jorge_Llamb=EDas?= To: lojban@googlegroups.com X-Original-Authentication-Results: gmr-mx.google.com; spf=pass (google.com: domain of jjllambias@gmail.com designates 74.125.92.25 as permitted sender) smtp.mail=jjllambias@gmail.com; dkim=pass (test mode) header.i=@gmail.com X-Original-Sender: jjllambias@gmail.com Reply-To: lojban@googlegroups.com Precedence: list Mailing-list: list lojban@googlegroups.com; contact lojban+owners@googlegroups.com List-ID: List-Post: , List-Help: , List-Archive: X-Thread-Url: http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/t/6edf3f52e6f491ba X-Message-Url: http://groups.google.com/group/lojban/msg/6743f46dca86c62c Sender: lojban@googlegroups.com List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 4:56 PM, Leo Molas wrote: > El 31/03/2010 04:43 p.m., Christopher Doty escribi=F3: >> >> I must say I find the disconnect between the claims of cultural neutral >> and violation of those claims in the very vocabulary of the language to >> be completely weird. =A0Illogical, even. > > I must say I agree with that last part. Some countries having a gismu > and others not isn't cultural neutrality. But also it's important to > maintain this gismu list. My own preference is to go along the lines of: http://www.lojban.org/tiki/experimental+cultural+gismu (That list covers mostly only European and South American cultures/countries, however.) I don't really like creating new gismu unless I'm going to use them. The Alice translation, for example, uses the unofficial gismu "nuzlo", for "New Zeland", and I have used a few others like spero, norgo, xorvo, talno. It's not such a good idea to invent a gismu for a language/culture you are not at least somewhat familiar with, because you ran the risk of creating things like "jungo" where "jonxo" might have been a lot better. (Or things like "ketco", which I still find really weird after all these years.) > Perhaps all of this should be done, as lojbab said, with fu'ivla, and > encourage all the people to use this ones instead of the existing gismu, > hoping all lojbanist find this gismu as awful as we do. A complete list of fu'ivla for all UN member countries would probably be a useful thing to have around. If anyone is going to go about it, they should probably search the wiki and the lojban wikipedia to save some effort, as there have been at least partial attempts before. mu'o mi'e xorxes --=20 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "= lojban" group. To post to this group, send email to lojban@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to lojban+unsubscribe@googlegrou= ps.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/lojban= ?hl=3Den.